Comments on: China: Draining the brain?

By: Tibor Blazko

Tibor Blazko — Wed, 09 Dec 2009 07:58:32 +0000

“lack of skeptism in Asia”
didn’t buddha say “be in the doubt” even in case of his ideas?
maybe in china konfuc wins?
(btw. going to museum in china you will see graph with china world oldest history followed by india, in india you can see first stripe with indian 7 thousands followed by china, i never been in egypt)

By: Ranger_lost_in_Mordor

Ranger_lost_in_Mordor — Wed, 09 Dec 2009 02:36:01 +0000

This is very interesting when you mentioned
the devoid spirit of skepticism.I have always believed that
any malfunctions can be traced back to the particular
management level ,wethere it happens within a corporation
or in a larger macro setting. While most asian countries
have a hisotry of more paternalistic ruling style than countries in the west, that could be a major reason for
the lack of skeptism in Asia. and this sounds even truer when you look at the chinese glorifying magnificent
5 thousand years of authoritarian hisotry and how the chinese government is now muffling and trampling the pposition. That surely is not going to foster an education with the spirit of questioning.
to foster a

By: Y. Borres

Y. Borres — Tue, 08 Dec 2009 16:25:33 +0000

I am not familiar to tertiary education in Japan. From what your friend said, it does suggest that the wrongly asserted idea of the teacher is always wiser is not exclusive to Chinese institutions. It is wrong because without the questions of a fresh mind, civilization wouldn’t have evolved in such a dynamic manner… And I have to say that most people do acknowledge the importance of questioning. Some openly, some with much restrain.

By: Tibor Blazko

Tibor Blazko — Tue, 08 Dec 2009 08:54:47 +0000

“Everyone has the same answers! Model answers for everyone!”
friend of mine was teaching at japanese university and he said was unable to get opposite opinion from students
when he said them it openly they replied how can student argue with him – he is a teacher
(and it was not just case oppose him directly but also other public version)

By: Tony

Tony — Tue, 08 Dec 2009 02:54:30 +0000

I’m now a sophomore in a key university in Chinese mainland.When I read this article, I feel deep worried about our future. I can absolutely say, that most people around me are lack of humanistic spirit and the awareness of the obligations of citizens. In my opinion,they’re the most silly geese in the world of university students all around the world.All the education we accept from Primary school to univeristy is to make us more foolish,in order to make us addict ourselvse to the control of the government(or the communist you hate).Besides, I’m the one who doesn’t have a big shot daddy so I have to rely on myself to fight for the accessory to go abroad. Now I’m not interesting in many courses in my university and I think the college is playing a joke on us all.They even aren’t aware of the word \responsibility\ .I agree with you on that Chinese education is nothing but a big fiasco while the government or the department of education is a huge lousiest crappy joke! Can I have your e-mail address? I want to contact with you and communicate with you intelligent guys! Thank u!

By: Y. Borres

Y. Borres — Thu, 03 Dec 2009 13:45:18 +0000

Also, institutions need to work on making electives more significant, to the teacher and to the student than they are now. Most of those courses are scheduled at night. Course requirement cannot be any looser. Teaching quality varies from teacher to teacher – I wonder what some teachers had done before the invention of Microsoft Powerpoint software. Barely half of the roster shows up; those who do don’t even bother to listen to the lecturer. No one is expected to have a core textbook. Teachers do not even bother to recommend one, let alone references. Students were graded according to a open-book exam and/or an essay on certain topics. Plagiarism has been enhanced by search engines and WWW.

By: Y. Borres

Y. Borres — Thu, 03 Dec 2009 12:39:23 +0000

Not just on political topics, but also on purely academic matters – as small as a teacher’s interpretation of a certain text and a student’s attempt to challenge it, without any disrespect to the teacher. I’ve seen many times in which the young mind that is capable of critical thinking, instead of being praised, was rejected, condemned. What, then, became of the students who saw this happen? Stand up and protest? Walk out? NO. They stick to a copy of the teacher’s teaching aid and memorize everything in it. Note-taking is not that important here… It makes me wonder if I have to attend the class at all.

By: M.V.Sankaran

M.V.Sankaran — Thu, 03 Dec 2009 12:14:50 +0000

A perusal of the above post and the comments thereunder clearly indicates that everywhere there is this discontent and grievance regarding the existing system of education — whether undergraduate, postgraduate or doctoral studies at the University level or even with the preliminary and secondary level of education at the school level. This is true not only within communist People’s Republic of China (PRC), but also, within India, which practices a ‘mixed economy’sort of system, with State monopoly in certain (core) sectors and private enterprise in certain other (non-core) sectors. There is a mixed sort of system even in certain areas like education, where private enterprise coexists with, and augments State initiative, but subject to certain regulations of the State for grant of recognition and for grants-in-aid. No one seems to be satisfied with the way things actually work out in the educational sphere (apart from many other spheres) and there is constant search for international level standards and a transparency that seems to be elusive. The result is ‘variable functioning ‘that even judicial intervention cannot often cure. ‘Merit’ is often lost in the meshes of a ‘reservation’ system for those caste groups and tribal groups as are educationally and economically backward, albeit without a proper system in place to remove the ‘creamy layer’ among those groups who have already become educationally and economically advanced. This kind of approach towards ‘group advancement’ and ‘equality’ affects the employment sector also, particularly with respect to recruitment to the Government (Central,State and Union Territories — in all the three organs of the State, that is, the Legislature, the Bureaucracy and the Judiciary), the Public Sector Corporations and Autonomous Institutions besides the Local Authorities ( Municipal Corporations and their Undertakings). There is a great pressure on the Private Sector also to conform to the policies of the State Organizations, particularly with respect to provisions for the ‘sons of the soil’ meaning thereby the ‘linguistic regional groups’ based on the official language of the region concerned within the country. There is an official language of the Union Government (viz., ‘Hindi’), but like the ‘Russian’ language in the former Soviet Union, that is not the language of all the regional States, particularly in the south and for the sake of those people, English (the language of the erstwhile Colonial rulers and now, as an internationally recognized language) continues to enjoy ‘associate official language’ status. Still the ‘English’ language is not taught universally at the preliminary and secondary school levels across the country and there is this gulf between the rural and urban areas with respect to the learning of, and acquiring a good command over that language, which is hard to bridge. Those students who are fortunate enough to acquire a good command over the English language alone have access to the higher educational facilities in the leading Universities of the U.S.A., U.K., Canada, Australia and New Zealand. Needless to say that they are the fortunate few who are born to well-to-do businessmen, professional persons, judges, senior bureaucrats, scientists and engineers who are gainfully employed within the country. And it is no secret that over the last five or six decades that many of their wards who have sought higher education in the western countries, and found lucrative employment there, have chosen to stay there and that is how, for instance, the Indian ‘diaspora’ as they call the Indians settled in the U.S.A., have grown to nearly three million strong, almost one percent of the population of that country. And they are in the ‘preferential’ category and not just motels, eateries and grocery shop owners. But, and I say this with some satisfaction, now that the economy in India is purportedly ‘booming’, there are lots of Indian students and expatriate Indians who want to return to their country and start their lives anew here, just as in China, with a difference that they would be returning to a country that has a democratic system of government (based on adult franchise) in place with the initial ‘socialist republic’ tendencies being replaced now by private initiative and enterprise and with less and less governmental regulations. And I say, welcome home to conflicts and tensions of a different kind from those of the developed Western countries!

By: Ranger_lost_in_Mordor

Ranger_lost_in_Mordor — Thu, 03 Dec 2009 04:23:53 +0000

Well,I’m actually an engineering student, and I love
science and logic.But most of my employeed classmates
told me technology/technical knowledge doesn’t matter
in a workspace, all you need to deal with is interpersonal
relationships. This is somewhat being justified by one of myclassmates who is now a senior officer of a local
state-run enterprises. He is the guy who barely graduated !
Having network or guanxi seems to the only applicable skills
to get the job done in China so that the teachers wouldn’t bother to provide any transferrable skills, and I just wonder
if they know there is any themselves !
Sorry to be so dramatic, but this is based on the very facts.

By: Ranger_lost_in_Mordor

Ranger_lost_in_Mordor — Thu, 03 Dec 2009 04:11:17 +0000

@Y.Borres

You get to the point.
Lack of respect for other people’s perspectives,especially when it comes to political issue, is one of the numerous syptoms of the numerous stall-fed students victimized from almost a centry long, nationalized and distorted education system.You may have a better understanding of this by taking a look at the virulent comments people dropped on chinese websites. As for the model thing,
since the communist party was actually a drone of Soviet Union, you simply can’t expect the kids it breeds can be any diversified.

By: Y. Borres

Y. Borres — Wed, 02 Dec 2009 17:32:47 +0000

I”m glad there’s discussion on the topic, better yet, it’s among people who have firsthand experience of the system. Being a young person born and raised in HK and an undergrad in China, it is shocking how differently students from the two sides of the border are, in terms of their Ability and Allowance to have perspectives of their own.
Whenever a lecturer or a classmate expresses themselves on, say, politics, I would say to myself, “Respect his/her perspective. You don’t have to agree with him/her to listen.” I wonder if I were to speak out my incontestable belief in democracy and individual freedom, would I be given the same level of respect, if not acceptance. This has been foreseen, but it becomes overwhelming when it appears as though everyone else has had a special package installed in their brains! It makes a university class seems so immature.
On methods of study, I can only say one thing – Everyone has the same answers! Model answers for everyone!

By: Marta Cooper

Marta Cooper — Wed, 02 Dec 2009 05:11:02 +0000

@Ranger_lost_in_Mordor

Thank you for joining in in the conversation. It is fantastic to get a student’s perspective. But I too am a graduate student in China and so I have experienced everything you mentioned. My apologies if I came across as yet another Westerner looking down upon China in the post.

I would agree with you that studies are not practical and do not prepare students in getting a job. But this is not the point of university education: instead, it is supposed to provide you with transferrable skills that you can take through with you to your chosen career. Perhaps the problem, then, is that this factor is not clearly communicated to Chinese university students?

By: Tibor Blazko

Tibor Blazko — Mon, 30 Nov 2009 10:05:21 +0000

“since 2007 … only a quarter returning after graduation”
if i remember well later situation already got to state when majority already returns home
so maybe so long time statistics usage only looks too negative

By: Ranger_lost_in_Mordor

Ranger_lost_in_Mordor — Mon, 30 Nov 2009 05:49:12 +0000

I’m now a second year graduate stduent from mainland China.I believe I know better what it is like to live and study in China than anyone who has never had to do so.After 2 years fruitless working life. I finally
decided to come back for Master Degree and hoped to
find a way breaking out of here. It’s just not I don’t like this country(I do hate the communist government though) or I
can’t get a job to survive here. It’s just the ways and rules you need to follow to get sth done and the bleak prospect you can see from whatever a chinese education that really drives me crazy,and thanks to the rules and cronyism I had experienced, I’m now getting a lot more flexiable ,or better put it, unscrupulous when I’m having to get sth done. But unlike those who are born to big shot daddies and are ableto affoard the money needed to study abroad, students like me without any solid strong social and economic network have to rely on nobody but themselves.
and here is sth fresh for you guys who may not have the chance to take a closer look at what chinese GRADUATE EDUCATION looks like .
Basically there are bound to be a few cliques infested in whatever universities in mainland China, my school is not an
exception. Typically there are 2 types of cliques who don’t
quite give a shyt to each other, one is those we call Greedy Bloodsucking Vampires who make their students work like slaves without the need to pay them ,at least with meagre amount of money. One of my classmates is now instructed by this sort of professor who made him work on the project for entire 2 weeks with less than 5 hours sleep each day ,even though he was about to cough his lung out at that time. Another type of professors are what we call Nerds Living in Fairylands. This is the kind of teachers who are losing out grounds and are not able to compete with potato-cooking mothers outside, so they sit back to school ,leaving the whole world behind, and live on what they believe ACADEMIC RESEARCH with a pinched pocket.
The point is most of the stuff they do are not practical and
can not even help their students to get a job outside on
the job market. If you are not seeing any value in what you are doing, are you going to take it seriously ? I of course wouldn’t !
Chinese education is nothing but a big fiasco while the communist government is a huge lousiest crappy joke. :)