The Moroccan monarchy is working on that but before achieving this inevitable outcome Moroccan people need to be educated to increase the actual indicators related to literate people, health…. You talked about the consequences of insulting the king or burning a national flag (that’s mine), Morocco is a nation with laws as any other democratic country. Can someone insult the president of the US in the US? Can some insult the Queen of Great-Britain in UK?…You can’t be serious. It happens everywhere in the world.
You are pessimistic about the autonomy initiative. The plan is essentially made to ensure the return of people in good conditions. Well, some people (like you) forget that the other duty of the MINURSO was to guarantee the return of people living in the camps to their motherland. Morocco has never blocked the return process. About 6000 people returned to Morocco since 1976. Morocco is welcoming anyone who wants to integrate a democratic process under the Moroccan sovereignty. We, the sahraoui unionists, accepted the reconciliation made by Morocco in the context of the Equity and Reconciliation Committee work. We turned the dark page of the history of Morocco and now we want more development. Of course, some of the Polisario leaders will never return to Morocco for old running revenge but the majority will do if they are allowed to. You have no idea about what the population is willing so there is no place for speculation about their mind. For sure you would support independence if you were persecuted and totally controlled in camps with controlled and limited movement.
The referendum is unrealistic for the reasons I told you many times before. Morocco & Polisario Front/Algeria have never agreed on ID lists. Each one of them tried to impose its view on the eligibility to vote. Morocco accepted the first version of eligibility conditions but Polisario Front/Algeria refused it. Then Morocco refused the second version which was accepted by Polisario Front/Algeria. The referendum became a sort of blocking issue. In such case, Morocco took the initiative to propose a revolutionary autonomy plan to pass through the status quo. Autonomy means the king is losing some of its royal prerogatives in the region of Western Sahara. It was unbelievable a few years ago (Hassan II rule). Regarding the identity of the sahraouis, I know perfectly that the unionist sahraouis are as sahraouis as (some of) the one living in Tindouf South Algeria. They are promoting the culture of the region in the whole country. They have their own TV in Laayoune city (a real one and not propaganda). They are represented in an official institution (CORCAS) who is doing a very good job to promote the culture on Internet (http://www.sahara-culture.com). Frankly saying, I believe you don’t have a real background on the issue. You definitely ignore the political/economic/social influence of the unionist sahraouis in the Western Sahara region.

Ahmed Salem

Brahim – the regions you talk about were not recognised, separate territorial entities prior to decolonisation, and were not invaded across a territorial boundary. But all people, including those in these regions, should have the right to self-determination if they want it.

You talk of democracy – does this mean you’re in favour of the Moroccan monarchy yielding power to an elected president or passing its powers to a parliament as has happened in the UK? There are measures of democracy but Morocco has a long way to go, given that it is illegal to insult the king. That sounds pretty absolute and undemocratic to me. As we say, people who live in glass houses shouldn’t throw stones. I love the way you equate respecting democracy with acceptance of an unelected centralised power. Delightfully orwellian.

The Moroccan plan is unworkable, because it does not address the status of the Polisario-controlled areas or the situation of the refugees. I very much doubt Morocco would welcome Polisario as a political movement, or many tens of thousands of independence minded Sahrawis. The result of the plan will be the maintenance of the status quo, the establishment of a rump Sahrawi state in the Polisario areas, or a Moroccan invasion of these areas precipitating regional conflict.

If a referendum is unrealistic (and I’m asking for a referendum, which may not yield a vote in favour of independence) it is only because people like you continuously say so. If there is enough support for a referendum, it will become realistic. So it is not a done deal. As a point of principle I think anyone whose mantra is “resistance is useless” should be resisted. To do otherwise is to give in to oppression and dictatorship. Morocco offers no hope for the Sahrawi living in exile, except the hope of permanent exile and assimilation into their host countries, with the loss of their culture and national identity. Of all people, you Moroccan nationalists should understand how dismal this prospect is.

I don’t believe this is your last comment – you keep saying so and then contradicting yourself. Perhaps your will is not as strong as you keep insisting….

Ahmed Salem

Ahmed Salem

Back to solution, all I can say is someone has to give up more. I just wished the autonomy was initiated by the Polisario. It would make everybody’s job easier. I don’t see the alternative. There are no other choices. They actually may miss this opportunity. It is saddening to see another generation grow up in the camps.
You may not like to hear this – Algeria started it. It is up to it to correct it. With the actual regime, I don’t see how that could happen…

As for the rest – so it IS a beauty contest! One in which the validity of your cause depends on whether the governments that support you are can be characterised as leftist or rightist. No-one agrees with the long-term holding of POWs (all now released), but neither should they agree with “disappearing” people. Or, for that matter, with things like Guantanamo or extraordinary rendition, which your white knights (US and France) have variously been involved in (as have many other “good” western countries). All governments and states do bad stuff. It should be condemned.

You may be right that in the end the international community will opt for appeasement, but that is no reason not to stand up for the right to self-determination.

Not sure about this idea about people knowing the realities on the ground making them more sympathetic to Morocco. They may take a different view when they see the reality of partition and realise that the autonomy plan will either (i) result in the creation of a rump Sahrawi state in the Polisario-controlled areas, (ii) necessitate a Moroccan invasion of these ares resulting in regional destabilisation, or (iii) change nothing at all. I presume this is why Morocco consistently denies that the Polisario has a presence in these areas, misleadingly characterising them as a “buffer zone”. This is a problem for the autonomy plan. I’d be interested to hear your solution.

The more other countries know about this conflict and the realities on the ground, the more they will take side with Morocco.
Keep counting how many more you will loose. You will be left with one: ALGERIA.
With the gas prices falling down, we will see how long it can hold.

The mistake the Moroccan government made is that it kept this conflict in the charge of few. Today, every Moroccan is concerned, and that is powerful.

As for support from Algerian and Libya – when fighting against an invading force you take your support where you can get it. Morocco has France as protector – surely you wouldn’t grudge the same rights to the Polisario? And the French have a history of behaving pretty badly too (as do most countries, mine included). So is this some sort of beauty contest in which support from certain countries is OK but support from others is unacceptable, even when we know all governments behave badly? You guys love to play the “evil communist/Marxist” card, but most people are too sophisticated to fall for such cheap and simple attempts to demonstrate guild by association. Maybe at the height of the Cold War there would have been some mileage in this, but not now.

As for endless discussion, did you see the exchange between me and Ahmed Salem? That was endless – this is a brief exchange by comparison.

From the UNHCR Country Operations Plan for Algeria, Planning Year 2007:

“Currently, UNHCR provides assistance to 90,000 vulnerable refugees, out of a total population estimated by the Government of Algeria at 165,000 people. The refugees are settled in four refugee camps –namely Alayun, Awserd, Dakhla and Smara, – in
the Tindouf governorate (wilaya) in the south-west of Algeria”
Source: http://www.pogar.org/publications/other/unhcr/algeria/cop-07e.pdf

From the World Food Programme (PROTRACTED RELIEF AND RECOVERY OPERATION— ALGERIA 6234.00, from 2000):
“Assistance to Sahrawi Refugees. Number of beneficiaries 155,000″.
Source: http://www.wfp.org/eb/docs/2000/wfp002811~1.pdf

The 90,000 figure represents the people deemed to be the “most vulnerable”, not the population of the camps. The WFP downgraded it’s estimate of the most vulnerable to 90,000 after 2006. Some said this was due to pressure from donors – certainly it is unlikely to be because conditions in the camps had improved massively, or because 65,000 people had disappeared.

We can be sceptical of the Algerian figures, but we should not confuse “most vulnerable” as estimated by UN agencies with absolute numbers. This has been a common tactic of Moroccan lobbyists (when they aren’t arguing that the number is much less than even 90,000). Glad to see you’re at least being consistent.

I do wish you’d stop all this propaganda – I’m trying to get some work done!

I’ll leave you to worry about the fine historical details, which the international court went over with a fine tooth comb before finding Morocco’s claim wanting. I know you reject the court’s conclusion, but that is your business. I refer anyone interested in the historical background and the nature of the historical claims to Tony Hodges’ excellent “Western Sahara: Roots of a Desert War.” Feel free to dismiss this as propaganda as you will anything that doesn’t support Morocco’s position.

Ancient historical claims are a notoriously bad basis for the solution of present-day political problems. If countries started claiming territory on the basis that their ruling dynasties or large sections of their population originally came from elsewhere, perhaps the UK could lay claim to parts of Germany, France (especially Normandy, Scandinavia and the Netherlands.

You could save yourself a lot of words by simply writing “God gave it to us” and “resistance is useless!” It would be as convincing.