This post is from our coverage of the 2008 Olympics in Beijing China, curated by John Kennedy and sponsored by Reuters.
· All posts
While authorities state she is of Olympic regulation age, China Digital Times‘ Xiao Qiang looks at one of several sources that put He Kexin's age at around fourteen.
Wow. People are really making this a big deal. Seriously, how can you fake it on your passport and birth certificate? Is it even possible? I just think that the U.S. are unable to accept their loss to the Chinese, and just because an American stated that she saw He Kexin has baby teeth, doesn’t mean that she’s below the minimum age requirements.
I don’t think it is the matter that the US can’t accept their loss to China, I feel it is more the “equality” factor. If she is not below the minimum age requirement then they should not have a problem at all producing the papers that prove she is of age and proving that in the national news light that they are being questioned in.
USA claims its a strong and confident country. Well it sounds USA thinks every one is out to cheat it with age limit, baby teeth, and what not. tsk tsk, US is NOT only a bad loser, but also a double head snake so excellent at creating lies.
That’s true. But I’m just mad because a lot of the press and other websites have stated that all the Chinese people are cheats, liars, and fakes while the truth behind this situation haven’t been figured out yet, and they still call us all a horrible country with horrible people.
I agree with you Tina, we should not be calling each other horrible people and cheats. As to respond to MuLan, the US was not the country that brought this whole situation to light…it was actaully newspapers in China that first began listing the gymnasts as being too young and that their birthdates were different a few years ago. I will say yes, I was disappointed that the US lost the team gold, but they lost it on their mistakes. The had the opportunities and could not capitalize, but what is boils down to is competition at this level needs to be fair. If they were not of legal age then they broke the rules. China is already VERY strong in the world of gymnastics and they do not need to lie about ages. So as I said before, if they are being honest, then all they need to do is provide the proof and this will all be over, but until then those gymnasts, and the country will have this dark cloud over what should be AND is a proud moment for their nation.
If it is the equality factor, why didn’t Mr Hamm give up his Gold Medal for the all around 4 years ago? It seems the American press + public has forgotten all about that little episode.
your all idiots….the government for china could have produced these girls passports and making there birthdate whatever they feel like…just because there passports say they are old enough doesn’t mean a thing….when i got my passport in the U.S….who made it?? the US government…..same things with the chinese…the government made He Kexin’s and made her old enough to compete…the chinese are cheaters because they want the world to think they are so great…..tell me why this is the first year the chinese have actually been one of the top contenders and competeing with the U.S for medal count and gold medals? Scandilous other countries….thats why i never travel outside of the U.S because of all the scandals i have come across dealing with other countries government and policing…you all can stay mad that your country sucks and is poor….i’ll keep riding down the street in my pearl white escalade on 22’s doing whatever the **** i want
Hey Califigga, US isn’t perfect and maybe where you live, it’s great and seem like the finest place to live, but you are building a concrete wall amongst yourself. There are places in US that are poor and suckish. And besides, China was always one of the top countries with the most medals, the second most in 2004. US is always first because they have great athletes and China is now gaining up because they want to do their best on home soil.
I think you should stop calling other people idiots are start looking in the mirror and take a good look at yourself. You shouldn’t judge other people without evidence, He Kexin’s issue hasn’t been finished yet. Even if she is under 16, you can call the Chinese Gymnastics Team a cheat, I don’t care, but you should say bad things about the people just because other people do and the press reported it that way. These aren’t your opinions on China, because you don’t even know what China is. Which is a fact because probably the closest you’ve been to China was at Pick Up Sticks.
And you’re American right? If you are, you are not a good citizen. Haven’t you ever heard of innocent until proven guilty? You are rude, and you can start talking trash all you want, but if you can’t understand that simple little thing, I don’t think you even know your own country well enough.
If you hate China so much, then stop buying 90% of America’s merchandise, cuz guess what? Most of them are all made in China…Hmm…I wonder why?
Stop using one little incident that the gymnasts might have done to blame the whole country!
Perhaps the reason so much of America’s merchandise is made in China is because the labor in Guangdong is mostly cheap underaged provincial girls who did not make the Olympic gymnastic squad. 东莞加油！
Actually, I love China very much and am extremely happy for the recent success of its female tennis players. Zheng Jie became the first Chinese tennis player to reach the Wimbledon singles semifinals and Li Na just beat Venus Williams in the 2008 Olympic competition.
中国加油！
I believe that He Kexin’s passport credentials are fake and that she should be disqualified from the Olympics immediately. Let’s not wait for He Kexin to appear on Chinese television several years later like Sydney bronze medalist Yang Yun and admit in an interview that she was only 14 in 2008. 国际奥委会加油！
I sincerely wish good luck to Liu Xiang, Li Na, Yao Ming, Wang Zhizhi and Guo Jingjing in their remaining Olympic events! 奥运加油！
An American dentist in Colorado would like to examine the young Chinese girl’s teeth. Opening ceremony singer Yang Peiyi, you might ask?
No, the teeth belonging to gold medal gymnast He Kexin!
whether He Kexin is 13 or 16 is the point. If she is 13 then the Chinese national team is manipulating a minor, someone who may or may not understand the punishment there body is under! She may or may not understand the consequences
Im sorry people but wake up. Rules are put in place for specific reasons. The discovery that a young teens body of 12-14 years is more nimble and flexible than a young adult isn’t news by any means. If everyone else is following the rules why doesn’t China have to? We have several gymnasts here in the U.S. that perform remarkably and would have contended that gold medal, but they were not present to do so because we follow rules and regulations set in place by the IOC. The fact that China produced false documents to slip these young girls into competition is disgraceful. You can make all the baby teeth arguments you want but when multiple sources from China have multiple articles about there [14] year old hero and are suddenly taken down by the Chinese government it becomes pretty blatantly obvious. My argument is not that it was unfair to the U.S. but rather that it was unfair to everyone. If all countries were allowed to use anyone they desired regardless of the age limit then we surely would have seen different results across the board in the gymnastics race. Would the U.S be on top? Would the gold have gone to Germany? Wether the age limit should be there or not is a moot point… Its the fact that if everyone has equal rules and regulations to follow isn’t it only fair that every one abides by them? Wether it should be in place or not, the point is that it is there and there for a reason. Nobody is exempt and if you don’t follow these specific rules, then you should either not be allowed to compete or be disqualified period.
To Califigga, I agree with Tina. Your most likely one of those hypenated-Americans. You’re either an American or not! It’s not He Kexin’s fault that the Chinese fixed her papers, if they did! Let the IOC handle it and it will get resolved.
It’s not even about the medals. I am an american and I am just very concerned for the girls’ if they are under 16. The legal age was raised to 16 for a very good reason. The torture they are putting the bodies through can be devastating if they are younger than 16. They’re at a very vulnerable stage in their development and too much stress could compromise their futures. Their government needs to think about these little girls and not their athletic reputation.
The fact that the IOC doesn’t want to investigate this means there are serious politics involved. By that I mean they don’t wnat to throw accusations agaisnt the host country of the Olympics. Perhaps they’re waiting for after the Olympics are over to launch an investigation. There’s a reason they set the age requirement at 16, because bones and muscles aren’t finshed developing at ages like 13 and 14 and can cause problems for these girls bodies later on in life. I wouldn’t be at all surprised if some of the Chinese gymnasts were underage seeing as this is a country that had no problem having children working in sweat shops. IF they do investiage and are found to have underage girls on their team, the team gold as well as all individual medals of the illegal participants should be stripped. It’s only fair and maybe sends a message to China for the next Olympics that cheating will not be tolerated. .
Let’s see. How is it possible to fake a passport and birth certificate in a country where the government is Communist and controls the process and is using “Project 119″ to win more medals? Pretty easily seeing as how we can fake passports and birth certificates here in the US where the process is more closely monitored.
I think a lot of people are naive here int he US where Pro sports are more important than medals. China’s own Chengdu Sports Bureau has reported her birth date as January 1, 1994 as well as a report on Chinese television months before that she was only going to be 14 at the Olympics. NBC played the clip after one of the swimming finals the other night.
Re previous poster Wei’s comments. How about, Chinese population : Canadian population ? Mmm, according to that ratio, China should have hundreds of gold medals. And of course, why would anyone suspect China of doctoring any documents after their unblemished
record of honesty in recent years, such as a plethora of dubious ‘world records’ in the sporting world, not to mention their computer-generated firework display and the Incredible Miming Girl at the opening ceremony?
I think this whole conversation is ridiculous. It seems as if some of these comments are not based on the situation. They are just a way to make hateful comments about other nations. I am a United States citizen and proud of it. However, I don’t think we live in a perfect place. That being said, who does? To characterize Americans as cheaters and liars is hypocritical because those are human traits, and that means there are liars and cheaters everywhere, even in China.
That being said, I wish the American government and media were more concerned with checking the validity of all documentation, including the illegal documentation used by undocumented workers, than whether a 14 year old go to go the the big girls competition. Priorities people?
Most people would agree that the right thing to do is remove or significantly lower the age limit, anyway. That means those gymnasts still would have kicked ass, only in a fair matter. Then again, what in this world is fair?!?
Additionally, to all of those who are commenting on the stress of those “poor young girls” who are competing at 14… each of the girls that you saw giving their all during competition have been training for years…. their body is under the same stress. They are competing in junior competitions with the same routines. The only difference is the platform.
Chinese girls tend to be very small, American girls don’t. I think a country with 1.2(?) billion people and a well-established gymnastics program has plenty of good gymnasts to fill their team without resorting to underage girls. The way I see it, if anyone has any solid evidence that any of the Chinese gymnists violated the rules, let them present it to the Olympic Committee. If not, stop whining about it. Behavior like that makes all Americans look bad.
The Chinese should be doing well enough without having to cheat, but that doesn’t appear to be the case. Considering that there are one billion more people in China than in the United States, surely they could have found at least 1 girl of age to challenge the best athletes in the world-Those from the U.S.
I don’t think that the Chinese press publishing a story about the age of one of their own athletes makes Americans look bad in any way. If America was so bad, then why are millions of people risking their lives every year trying to get in?
Just think of how dominant the U.S. would be with a billion more people to choose from.
I think the issue here is not one of whining on the part of the Americans, it is one of the Spirit of the Olympics. I am an American. Marion Jones was stripped of 5 medals and banned from Beijing. GOOD!!! How would you feel if you took second place and were stripped of the chance to stand on the podium as the winner because someone lied about using drugs or their age. Cheating is cheating no matter what country you live in.
And BTW for anyone not paying attention:
NBC, during the Olympics, aired a Chinese reporter doing a story on the ages of the Chinese gymnasts and showed pictures of the submissions to International competitions for the last four years. It is clear that about 2-3 years ago, the Chinese reported many of their ages differently. All of them were exactly 2 years older.
There is something called rules that the Olympic Committee puts out. The reason for the age limit is that the younger are more flexible. If it didn’t make a difference why would the Chinese be working around the rules and regulations?
There are rules against drugs. Anybody caught using them, U.S. 2000 Mens relay team, have the medals taken away. I totally agree with that. It’s cheating. This is cheating as well. The rules should be enforced. Period. End of story.
In Chinese newspaper profiles this year, He was listed as 14, too young for the Beijing Games.
The Times found two online records of official registration lists of Chinese gymnasts that list He’s birthday as Jan. 1, 1994, which would make her 14. A 2007 national registry of Chinese gymnasts — now blocked in China but viewable through Google cache — shows He’s age as “1994.1.1.”
Another registration list that is unblocked, dated Jan. 27, 2006, and regarding an “intercity” competition in Chengdu, China, also lists He’s birthday as Jan. 1, 1994. That date differs by two years from the birth date of Jan. 1, 1992, listed on He’s passport, which was issued Feb. 14, 2008.
Ok, check this out…
Look at some of these Chinese gymnasts. There’s NO WAY IN HELL that some of these girls are 16 (or 15), ESPECIALLY ESPECIALLY ESPECIALLY He Kexin!!!!!
Now, saying that He Kexin cheated (which I TRULY TRULY belive) does NOT mean that I believe all Chinese are cheaters! Nor does it mean that I think the Chinese government is corrupted (I’ve got NO problems with China, and I wouldn’t mind visiting there one day, either). I think that one or two people helped He Kexin produce false documents “verifying” her FALSE age of 16. I think they should take away HER medals, and HER medals only. Let the rest of the Chinese gymnasts who are OF AGE keep their medals, even though He Kexin cheated, helping them get their medals (team).
Also, this would allow Nastia Liukin to receive the gold medal that she EARNED from the uneven bars, because her routine truly was better (By the way, what the hell is up with the Austrailian judge?? And why do all the judges want to give the Chinese better scores when their routines weren’t better? Could it be because the Chinese girls are “cute” because they are so young? Hmmm… harder to give a lower score to a child than an adult…).
Not saying He Kexin’s routine was bad, I think she’s a phenomenal gymnast (as are all the Chinese gymnasts, although Nastia Liukin and Shawn Johnson are better), but… let’s be fair people, seriously.
If there are age rules, they need to be followed, and that’s all there is to it.
Of course everyone is going to think you are a bunch of liars, when during the opening games you have a “pretty” Asian girl sing infront of the crowd and have the “ugly” Asian girl with the voice behind a curtain just so your country looks good. You got more bad press from that than if you would have just allowed the “ugly” girl to sing face to face with the crowd. However, I do not believe it would be hard to fake any “offical” Chinese document considering that China will apprently do anything to make their country look good. There sure are a lot of Chinese athletes born on January 1, 1994.
I’m saddened yet frustrated to witness what China has stooped to, apparently. Why hasn’t this been investigated? How can cheating be tolerated and yet the child continues to compete? As a 45 yr old woman who did gymnastics many years ago, I agree that a 14 yr old girl can have an advantage over a 16+ yr.
My husband said that the uneven bar competition looked like a little girl [He Kexin] competing against a woman [Nastia]!
The real issue is the cheating that seems to go on and it’s tolerance. It simply is unacceptable to cheat. Now I realize that this little girl’s bones haven’t been tested to prove her age, but it doesn’t take a rocket scientist to figure out that her age is in question for a valid reason… She simply looks 12-13 yr old.
News clips proving her age? Make them available and pull her medals and kick her a– out of the competition. End of story.
The country of origin is irrelevant.
Cheaters are unacceptable, any time, any place. What kind of message do they think the world is receiving? A country based upon integrity? I certainly hope so, but it doesn’t appear to be the case.
This is bad for for China. How can their citizens take pride in anything? It is obvious that they worked very hard to show the world how hospitable they can be. Everything is beautiful. Yet, none of that will be remembered because it will be overshadowed due to a lack of integrity.
However, this situation is consistent with China. Think about the quality of China’s products [to quote a previous commentator, 90% of our products are from China because?] It looks like it could be nice and just as good as products made in the USA, you take a chance and buy it [because it's cheap], but end up throwing it out because it’s really just a front for junk.
How could anyone have expected anything more? Sad… truly sad. It was the one opportunity to change, and it’s blown.
Please let’s not insult each other. The American Team lost because they were not as good as the Chinese. I was born in a communist country where athletics are made not trained. I wouldn’t doubt that the government altered the papers to show she was older. But if it is true the Chinese newspaper first ran the story then I am not so sure. Remember, China may look and act in some areas as a free (capitalism) country but they are a communist country at the end. In communist countries nothing happens by chance everything is planned. Trust me I lived. Going back to the subject of the Chinese athletic being too young. I am not a doctor and I know they are not the tallest people in the world but just look at her face. It is like a baby’s face, very soft and without any signs of puberty. As a lot of you already know, when girls become women it is a hormone rush through the body. To me she looks 12. PLEASE do not insult each other; we all have our points of view. But remember anything is possible.
Why don’t we let them have fun in what they train for all their lives just about…. so what if she is 10 or what ever… if this is what she has train for so hard and she or any other person is ready then let them compete…. what is a 50yr wanted to compete are we going to stop him or her?
let people be china usa russia germany whoever… when it comes down to it we all bleed red. we can’t look at it from an american viewpoint all the time, this is an all country event.
have a good day and hug a chinese a russian a german a puerto rican hug any othere cause the next time your in need it may be just one of them that comes to your aid…. and never say never.
let’s close this topic it’s pointless unless you’re living in the stoneage
MUST SEE website that has links to articles as well as screen shots of the articles explaining when & what they say of HE KEXIN …. very interesting stuff i must say!
The Chinese are definitely cheaters. I had Chinese neighbors, who enrolled their 2 kids in our school system as being about 2yrs younger than their actual ages. I know for a fact they are older because the daughter who is supposed the same age as my daughter was a toddler when my daughter was born…but now they are the same age—yeah right. This really sucks because it gives them an advantage mentally and also in sports. The son consistently does well in basketball…gee, wonder why when he’s 2yrs older than all of the rest of the kids???
There has been proof online of He’s age, but the Chinese govt. removed all of it…again, wonder why?? Age matters a LOT in gymnastics (and figure skating) because as bodies reach puberty, changes happen that make it more difficult to do some of the maneuvers. There have been lots of stories of gymnasts, dancers, skaters, etc. all of a sudden not being able to excel as they have in the past due to bodily changes through puberty. This is why age matters in gymnastics, and especially at a global even like the Olympics!
The Chinese govt. doesn’t care about people or about any of the spirit of the Olympics. What they care about is making China look good and making China, the country, exceed all other countries at any cost. They don’t care about He. She’s disposable as soon as her gymnastic days are up. That’s China.
1 shame on China IF the winner is under-aged.
2 shame on USA IF they are accusing underage if it was not true.
BUT MOST OF ALL why does it even matter what the age is? no one seems to mind other olympians being 15 or 14 in other sports. Isn’t this about being the best in the world? if so, then why should atheletes be excluded if they are the best of their country?
ADMITTEDLY i do believe 2 gold medals should be awarded if atheletes tie instead of creating some realllllllllllllllly dodgy system to break the tie using some random equation.
btw Dnn puberty lasts till 18 years of age for chicks but you don’t see the minimum age limit at 18 and yet by your standards girls minimum age should be 18 and guys at 21. oh and not all tall people are good at basketballs, some teams have a wide range of heights for their players. a tall person who can’t aim or shoot would do worse at basketball than a short person who can shoot.
Also asians enrol kids late into school because they believe their children will get picked on due to their size. so if you want to complain Dnn, you ought weed out bullying in school first.
To Tina and Mulan
I know of a Chinese person in Australia who uses 2 birthdates 2 yrs apart- she quotes one of them as her ‘official’ one and the other one she cannot explain
go figure….and she has passport/ other docs supporting her claims……….wonder how ??
Then again she is a tax cheat & immigration cheat ( visa overstayer ), so should be no surprise really
cheers, Jeff
ps she cites some ‘official blunder’ to explain how she has 2 completely different DOBs ( diff day, month and year….) big stuff up- i don’t think so !! cheater
I’m Chinese, proud to be one, yet I can see this logically. He KeXin is born in 1994, according to several (not just one) older Chinese media sources starting from 2006 (Chengdu Sports Bureau website, China Daily Newspaper, Liu Peng - director of general administration of sport for China in Wuhan city). In a nutshell, these sources reported her actual age from 2006-2007 as she entered the gymnastic sport in China as a rising star.
And if she is really 14 as of 2008, then it’s not at all a case of sore loser syndrome for USA. It’s a matter of not playing by the rules. If the rules are legally changed and the minimum age is 14, then there’d be no controversy. No one would have any problems. All countries can openly use younger girls and everyone would be playing by the same rules.
Lots of other rules are broken all the time and athletes are disqualified, because those rules are normally investigated to the extent where you discover the truth. Doping is easily verified beyond a shadow of a doubt. However, as far as gymnastics, all they do is a simple passport check (almost like an honor system, or if you say you are this age, then you are), without any extensive verification or investigation as in the case of doping and other more easily verifiable offenses.
Also, no, obviously the Chinese people as a whole is not shady. It would be wrong to generalize any groups of people. But the government that has a lot of say in a lot of things (don’t even try to debate me that this is not true), is the shady entity. Don’t get me wrong. I’m proud to be Chinese and proud that the PRC is making steady improvements, but it will take a few more years to reach its potential and be respected in every way.
to me, what’s amazing is that it seems like most of the people that are commenting seem to be from China..esp the top three.i would assume ur writing for the Chinese gov to try to take the negativity of ur gov. pathetic!
A young girl:
“I have put in a lot of efforts and time in polishing my skills in gymnastic.”
“I hope to be a winner for what I have been trained hard for”.
“Now, my dream came true, I have won a Gold Medal, many said that I look like just (underage) too young.”
“I thought it is good to have a nice younger look.”
“My instructor did not train me to look older for the competitions.”
“I have proved to the World, even “young looking” can do better than “older looking”".
“Ultimately, I believe that it is my skill level that win the Gold Medal in the competitons.”
“There has been a controversy as to her actual age. Her 2008 passport and the Fédération Internationale de Gymnastique (FIG) list her date of birth as January 1, 1992,[3][4] which would make her 16 years & 220 days old during the 2008 Olympic opening ceremonies and therefore old enough to compete. However, her age as of 2008 was reported by the Chinese press as 14 in news articles[4][2][5] that were later taken off-line.[6][7] Her birthdate has also been given by the Chengdu Sports Bureau and other registration sources as January 1, 1994, which would make her 14 years, & 220 days old during the Opening ceremonies, and therefore too young to participate in the 2008 Summer Olympics.[4][2][6][7] In addition, in a November 2007 speech in Wuhan, Chinese sporting official Liu Peng introduced He as a 13-year-old.[2][7] On August 2, the International Olympic Committee stated that they would not investigate the discrepancy in He’s reported age, stating that the FIG’s own verification system would be acceptable proof of eligibility. The FIG, in responding to the situation, stated that they would not ask for additional proof of age beyond the passport already supplied by Chinese officials.[8][9] However, the matter continues to be a source of controversy among members of the gymnastics community and the media.[6]“
“There has been a controversy as to her actual age. Her 2008 passport and the Fédération Internationale de Gymnastique (FIG) list her date of birth as January 1, 1992,[3][4] which would make her 16 years, & 220 days old during the 2008 Olympic opening ceremonies and therefore old enough to compete. However, her age as of 2008 was reported by the Chinese press as 14 in news articles[4][2][5] that were later taken off-line.[6][7] Her birthdate has also been given by the Chengdu Sports Bureau and other registration sources as January 1, 1994, which would make her 14 years, & 220 days old during the Opening ceremonies, and therefore too young to participate in the 2008 Summer Olympics.[4][2][6][7] In addition, in a November 2007 speech in Wuhan, Chinese sporting official Liu Peng introduced He as a 13-year-old.[2][7] On August 2, the International Olympic Committee stated that they would not investigate the discrepancy in He’s reported age, stating that the FIG’s own verification system would be acceptable proof of eligibility. The FIG, in responding to the situation, stated that they would not ask for additional proof of age beyond the passport already supplied by Chinese officials.[8][9] However, the matter continues to be a source of controversy among members of the gymnastics community and the media.[6]“
Per Andy (comment#38)
“And if she is really 14 as of 2008, then it’s not at all a case of sore loser syndrome for USA. It’s a matter of not playing by the rules. If the rules are legally changed and the minimum age is 14, then there’d be no controversy. No one would have any problems. All countries can openly use younger girls and everyone would be playing by the same rules.”
You say… “if the rules are legally changed to age 14, then there’s no controversy.”
BUT, the current point is the current age IS 16. that’s the problem. nothing to do with sore loser or gold medals. nothing to do with one country vs. another country.
In November 2007, Liu Peng introduced her as an “13-year-old uneven-bar gymnast.
ON May 23 2008 story in the China Daily newspaper, the official English-language paper of the Chinese government, had He’s age as 14.
On the Chengdu Sports Bureau website - Chengdu is the capital of Sichuan province in southwest China - a file dated January 2006 shows He Kexin as being born Jan. 1, 1994.
Somebody in Beijing with a registered journalist’s credentials needs to go to the next IOC press conference and ask about He Kexin’s identity card. The Chinese government probably found a way to alter that as well, but at least it’s another way to verify her age.
It’s time the international press exercise their promised press freedom and press the IOC into action with evidence presented on open laptops.
Here’s an article that discusses this issue and addresses why the IOC is stuybbornly resisting any investigation beyond examining He Kexin’s fake passport.
Somebody in Beijing with a registered journalist’s credentials needs to go to the next IOC press conference and ask about He Kexin’s identity card. The Chinese government probably found a way to alter that as well, but at least it’s another way to verify her age.
It’s time the international press exercise their promised press freedom in Beijing and press the IOC into action with evidence presented on open laptops.
Here’s an article that discusses this issue and addresses why the IOC is stubbornly resisting any investigation beyond examining He Kexin’s fake passport.
Andy, You are correct, no one should be including all Chinese people in their comments. If HeK is actually underage to compete I blame the powers that control this. This isn’t a choice made by her or the people of China. Just as the Iraqi war isn’t the choice of all Americans, but a government decision. Yet, it seems, the hatred by extremists include all Americans. All this is so unfair, but I suppose just human nature.
If HK is underage then she should not be allowed to keep the gold medal. Not because it would punish her but because it is the fair thing.
Meanwhile, I have to say that I believe the olympics have been wonderful, the opening ceremonies the best I have ever seen and the NBC coverage has been great.
Andy, You are correct, no one should be including all Chinese people in their comments. If HeK is actually underage to compete I blame the powers that control this. This isn’t a choice made by her or the people of China. Just as the Iraqi war isn’t the choice of all Americans, but a government decision. Yet, it seems, the hatred by extremists include all Americans. All this is so unfair, but I suppose just human nature.
If HK is underage then she should not be allowed to keep the gold medal. Not because it would punish her but because it is the fair thing.
Meanwhile, I have to say that I believe the olympics have been wonderful, the opening ceremonies the best I have ever seen and the NBC coverage has been great.
well… there is a lot of sources putting kexin at about 14 years old. not to mention china has had an athlete underage before and announced it on national tv after the olympics. look at yao ming- the chinese government has been monitoring yao since the day of his birth. he’s had foot problems and still they have him play tho apparently it’s extremely painful (and potentially career ending) if china makes him continue for now. so it’s not completely impossible. it just seems every time there’s some form of documentation showing he kexin’s actual age including old information in news papers and the internet- it all disappears. it is quite odd… and very questionable. i dont think it’s a matter of equality or being a sore loser or anything. it’s a matter of principal. if you’re under age- you’re under age. you do not belong in the olympics. however- if she is underage, it must be quite embarassing for those that lost to a 14 year old. that is impressive. but nonetheless.. the legal age to compete is 16- dont lie about it. very simple. there’s just too much pointing to the direction of “B.S.”- the chinese government puts a lot on perception. they wouldn’t even allow a little girl to be put on tv to sing their national anthem because she wasn’t “cute enough.” i’m not sure how you can say that about a 7 year old but… then again.. i live in the U.S. apparently things work just a little differently. it’s sort of sad really.
You’re all forgetting that China’s olympian’s don’t need to produce a passport to be in their own country. While I think it is a bit persnickety for US to bitch about He’s age, It is breaking the rules that she is under 16 and performing. She should be disqualified on that alone. Sorry people but I truly don’t believe she is 16. I’d feel this same way if it was any country and the loser was any country. Its just not fair game
It has already been confirmed that the Chinese gymnast, He, is only 14 years old. Her birthday is January 1, 1994. There are old articles in the Chinese newspaper, specifically one from last year where they even mentioned He as being 13. I have Chinese co-worker who actually has a printed Chinese article in which states she was 13 last year which makes her only 14 this year. There are also several old articles that were on the web that we have seen which have since been removed by the Chinese government. The Chinese government can easily change a passport. It just is not fair to break the rules and the fact that Nastia and He tied for uneven bars and then have the gold go to a gymnastic who technically doesn’t even qualify to be in the Olympics is just unfair — plain and simple !
well I guess people can’t let this go, but I guess they need to vent on something so trival.
Like i said before and somone here said it also these games are for the best of the world and if these people train so hard and are ready them let them compete what is wrong with that and what if a older person say 50 wanted to compete is there am issues there? If so then these games are just a bunch of crock cause of age limits there were no age limit in the orignal games why change now maybe they should look at these games and review it all.
Maybe they should have person only born the country compete even if they are a citizen of that country.
stop calling people cheaps and other names that are uncalled for when you do that you make yourself look ugly as a human. let this be and the powers that be will sort this out.
sorry for any typos hard to writing while the bus is moving
CC, bullying is nothing new in schools and certainly not an American specialty. Is it right? Of course not, but it’s something that will always happen to some extent everywhere, not just in US. Also, these Chinese kids are definitely not small. They have always been taller than average for their age (their TRUE age). I believe that they are lying about age because the kids didn’t know the language that well, so the mother wanted them to start “younger” so they’d have a chance to learn. That was her intention, but it’s unintentionally given them other advantages. The daughter messes up and says her true age sometimes, but then she quickly covers up. I think if you want to enroll your kids two years later, that’s not an issue—lying about it and making everyone think your kids are the same age as mine and everyone else’s is what I take issue with. At least be honest. I’m Asian and came to this country even older than her kids, yet we were put in the public school system (with me only knowing how to say ‘yes’ and ‘no’ in English), but all of my siblings and myself learned the language within 6 mos. It’s not hard for kids to pick up language, so it really wasn’t necessary for her to do that.
Also, I’m not talking about older kid sports, I’m talking about middle school & junior high as that’s their ages right now—and being bigger & older does give them an advantage. There’s a reason why our sports teams require proof of age when signing up, just like there’s a reason why there’s an age limit on gymnastics.
Oh, btw, Nastia was good enough for 2004, but she couldn’t go because she was only 14 (same age as He). Because she follows the rules, she missed out on an Olympics, plus who knows how well she would have done. Is that fair?
I’m also sick of the excuses being made for the Chinese govt. It’s clear, from the numerous previously published articles, that He is underage. What is galling is that the govt goes to these lengths to cover it up to further their ends. I know the Chinese govt is like that, so I’m not surprised, but I don’t have to like that this occurs. I think everybody needs to wake up and open their eyes to what their govt is doing…not just China. The USA govt is pretty awful in many different ways, but our people are just as blinded or indifferent.
Ok, this country is already behind them, so you know they faked her passport. they also deleted everything that has to do with her and gynastics. they wiped out every record except for a couple that clearly states her real birthdate. if they went back and deleted those records now, they they would have a higher chance of getting caught.But seriously she looks WAY to young. China shouldn’t get away with it! the olympics are in their country this year and they should at least set some standored of example to other countries…expecialy being a host this year! China should be kicked out for cheating if they caught them forigening the passports!
He Kexin is not 16 years old. China has broken the rules. End of story.
As other people have said, the sad part about this is that a Communist government has forced at least one (quite possibly more) little girl to lie to the world about her age, and she’ll have to deal with skepticism for the rest of her life if she doesn’t come clean.
It’s disgusting that some of you are defending the actions of an illegitimate country with no regard for human rights, a country so concerned with looking good that they take away the livelihood of their people, cheat in official competition, and pressure the Olympic authorities to look the other way.
I enjoy reading these posts; esp when people think they have the right to change things…Just ask Paul Hamm why he still think he is the all around champ in 2004.
In China, they have to have a birthing license. Now, with that being said, there is a record of He Kexin’s real birth. Since her age is such an issue, the government should produce this document and the ink needs to be verified to make sure that it wasn’t recently written (yes that can be done). If the government is not willing to relinquish this paper, then the IOC should launch a full investegation. If her age comes out that she is 16 or turning 16 this year then the athlete looks very young for her age (personally I am 29 and people think I’m 20). If her age comes out that she will not be 16 at all this year, then her medals need to be taken and given to the proper athletes.
It isn’t that the USA feels we should get all gold, but if every other country is following the new guidelines on age restrictions, then the host country should too.
I was NOT born in CHina, so I am not sure, to me my birthdate determines my age. I heard my parents mention in the old days, Chinese would count their age based on the year they were born in, NOT the actual birthdates. Is this still true today?
So if this system is still utilized, it makes a person at least one year older than their true birthdate. say I was born December 31, 1987, I would not have reached one year old until Dec 31, 1988 right? According to Chinese calendar or Chinese’s way of counting, I would have been two by Dec 31, 1988 Thus a new year is always an additional year/age for a person, not their birthdates.
Wei, do you think it’s funny when a country cheats, squashes freedom, persecutes people based on their religion, massacres Tibetans, tortures people based on political belief and restricts access to outside information?
Somehow I don’t think that deserves a “lol.” Grow up.
Califigga is perfectly right with the way the passports got printed. Just last year a chinese commentator introduced her as a 13 year old and there was no effort to fix what was said because it is true. Its not the US is whinning that they didnt win gold, but furious because countries, like China, cheat and get away with it.
Not only is China lying about the gymnasts age but the judging is ridiculous! In the womans vault finals, American gymnast, Alicia Sacramone, landed both her routines. Then Chinese gymnast, Fei Cheng, landed her fist routine and fell on her kness the second routine and beat Sacramone and took Bronze. Rip-off!!
If she is 14 then China broke the rules, if she is 16 then good for her and team China. I think if this was a U.S. girl being questioned for being 14 there would already be an investigation going on by the IOC and people screaming for all of USA women’s gymnastics to be stripped of medals for these Olympics. But then again everyone loves to hate the U.S.
Well, I don’t think China cheats. It’s not even impossible. There are about 6 judges.none of the judges are Chinese or from China. It’s very clearly on the TV next to their score.They’re probably jealous. In school,the Chinese always got higher scores. The Chinese are good at everything and this year China has more gold medals.They just can’t accept China is on the lead.They have no proof China is cheating. No matter what you say or what you do. You can’t change the fact. Only losers does this.Some of the USA coaches are Chinese. They’re from China.For example Shawn Johnson’s head coach:Liang Chow. Liang Chow is a former gymnast and the coach of the volleyball team.
American Swimmer Katie Hoff won three gold medals at the world championships in 2007 and is preparing for her second trip to the Olympics in Beijing in 2008. Hoff competed in the 2004 Olympics at the age of 15, finishing fifth in her heat in the 400-meter individual medley and seventh in the 200-meter IM.
Why no age limit in Swimming ? No swimming for those under 16? I thought sport is good for all human beings?
Athletes are free go for any events if they can good at it ? Ultimately, The fact is they went there to show off their skills in the competitions.
Shawn Johnson is 16, but she looks too adorable to be 16. She looks more like 14 or 15ish, then again it’s just looks. It does not matter, besides rooting for the Chinese, I root for Shawn too. My family and friends agree that Shawn and Kexin look so adorable.
Are you joking? There are no age limits for swimmers because their bodies aren’t being put at the same risk. Remember, the IOC (including China), voted on the current age limit for gymnastics. Any athlete who breaks the rules, no matter whether they agree with the rules or not, deserves to have their medals stripped for CHEATING!
I see a lot of America bashing on this post. The average American, i.e. ME, would rather see the most prepared person win regardless of which country they some from. Many times I have seem cocky, talented Americans/athletes lose because of their lazy training habits and I think that is awesome.
If you win and you deserve it, good for you. If you break the rules and get caught, “good riddance”.
However, I am all for lifting the age limit and allowing the best to compete. If we find out that a country is breaking any International laws when it comes to their health and well being, then we should step in. And in America’s case, if they have oil in their country we certainly will.
Bela has stated many times that he is in complete disagreement with even having an age limit. He and his wife, both, would rather see gymnasts of any age compete if they are truly deserving. Bela has even stated that the Romanians faked passports before. He truly knows the ins and outs of gymnastics, the good and the bad.
You seem to be a people basher and should probably be kicked off the post. However, it seems like the moderators are much like the IOC and are going to let you and China get away with it.
Richard, it’s time to stop talking to these people. It’s obvious that they’ve been totally nationalized (read: brainwashed) by their govt. China is best, China never cheats, China govt is wonderful, etc. The swimming comment is a total strawman argument. You’re right in that swimming and gymnastics have no comparison in terms of what it does to the body. Also, there is the petite fact that the gymnastics governing body came up with the age limit. The swimming governing body did not for a reason. It’s not like we in the USA came up with the limit and all of a sudden decided to complain about it when He won. We’ve had gymnasts who missed out or were past their prime due to the age limit, but that’s the way it goes when you FOLLOW THE RULES.
While it’s true that China does remarkable things, it doesn’t totally offset the really bad things that they do. Humans are not humans in China. They are cogs—THINGS—for the Chinese govt. It’s too bad that so many of their citizens accept that and blindly trumpet the greatness of China. It’s clear to most of the world the truth regarding He. Only the Chinese don’t like to hear it, but then who likes to hear something bad being told about themselves?
America used to be a a lot freer, but in recent years, our govt has become more like China and thanks to the media our people are becoming more brainwashed unthinking cogs like in China. I think our govt has been taking cues from China’s iron-fisted management of their masses. Just today I read about two old women in their 70’s being threatened with one year of “forced labor” because they had the audacity to apply for a permit to protest in an area that the Chinese govt said was an official protest area. So far NOBODY has been allowed a permit to protest in these “official protest” areas, and in fact some who have applied for the permits have been taken away and not heard from again. That’s China for you. Be warned, with the kind of leaders we’ve been “electing”, we’re not very far from a Chinese way of life. Soon we won’t even be able to make these kinds of posts online or visit many websites online without running through proxies to get around govt web bans. But, remember, even when we go the way of China, we must always parrot about the greatness of our people and our nation, and if anybody says otherwise we’ll LOL and say sour grapes. We’ll turn a blind eye to the people who disappear because they don’t like the govt, or we’ll just have to suck it up when our children die in crumbling schools, or when babies and adults alike die from disease due to the polluted air, land, and streams. Think of how much we could produce when our kids get to work and all of us are paid a whole few dollars a day! Why, we could become a great nation just like China! And we’ll raze over inconvenient homes to build a giant Olympic center and force our people to learn to perform for the ceremonies—oh, only good looking people need apply we don’t want any uglies—we’ll do all of this to look good for other nations to hide the ugliness underneath the exterior that we don’t want people to see.
Plan:
61
Wei, do you think it’s funny when a country cheats, squashes freedom, persecutes people based on their religion, massacres Tibetans, tortures people based on political belief and restricts access to outside information?
Somehow I don’t think that deserves a “lol.” Grow up.
————-
Your canned answer makes me LOL a lot more; because you have no freaking idea of what you talking about.
TO RICHARD AND CHAN: the 15 year old swimmer was going to turn 16 in the year of the olympics, wich is the rule ! They must complete 16 in the year of the olympics, wich mean they can be 15 at their competition day…
He kexin was announced as a ‘13 year old gymnast’ last year, in a gymnastic event. I just wonder why no one bothered to correct them ! and no one bothered to correct the many websites that wrote things about her also annoucing her as 13 last year!
you know why? because He wasn’t in the chinese olympic team at the time ! in fact, she was only chosen to be a part of the official olympi team some weeks before the olympics!
If I were american, i would sure be pissed, because if it wasn’t for He, the american team would have had Nastia Liukin winnig the gold on the uneven bars, and the gold for the team ( i don’t know if that is the name, i’m from brasil) competition !
the chinese have LIED their asses off right from the start, about everything ! for god’s sake, they put a fake 9 year old girl to playback the original singer because they tohught she was too UGLY to sing in the opening ceremony! they also have FORBIDDEN chinese journalists to publish the death of the father of one american who was in beijing to compete in the olympics ! they announced the man as a ‘tourist’…
based on all the crap they have tried to hide, i have NO DOUBT this girl isn’t 16.
and yes, if the government is involved, OF COURSE she could have her ID faked !
and, by the way, china is and excellent competitor in the artistic gymnastic, but they had no one who was as good as Nastia Liukin in the uneven bars, except for He… and we all know that they were looking for winners in every single category! and i don’t think that that is a wrong thing - i think they are really good, fei cheng especially is terrific - i just think that there is no need to lie more and more as they have
The age rules differ from sport to sport. Figure Skating is 15, gymnastics is 16. For gymnastics the FIG raised the minimum age from 14 to 15 in 1981. In 1997, it went to 16.
So, Nadia won the event at 14, which was legal at the time. It is now illegal. BTW, there is a 12 year old swimmer in the Beijing Olympics from Cameroon, Antoinette Joyce Guedia Mouafo.
Also, it is not just He Kexin, it is all three of the following that have been proven underage by theie Chinese ID cards: He Kexin, Jiang Yuyuan and Jang Yilin.
MuLan - Thin of it more in terms of Population Density.
China’s - 138 people per square mile
US’s - 31 people per square mile
That puts China at 75th and the US at 180th in the World.
All those other countries (74 of them) have worse population densities than China and they are not all worse off.
Natalia - There is a 12 year old swimmer in Beijing. The age limits differ from sport to sport. Men’s football used to be 23, figure skating is 15, gymnastics USED to be 14 and is now 16.
MuLan - Funny, I live in New Orleans where Katrina happened. Read up on what really happened instead of reading the tabloids. People who have no idea how democracy really works seem to think that everything should come free, even money!
True story: There are still people living in the government supplied (FEMA) trailers that have taken the money to rebuild their houses and bought plasma TVs instead and now refuse to leave the trailer because they don’t have enough money to fix their house.
@ natalia#74,
“the 15 year old swimmer was going to turn 16 in the year of the olympics, wich is the rule ! ”
She was born in June 1989, in 2004 she was 15. Going to turn 16 in the end of 2004? No, I think she was still 15 and half in the end of 2004 by western counting. In Chinese counting , she will be 16 and half by the end of 2004.
In regards to Passports, Every Government from the US,Japan, UK, and China, are responsible for all offical documents. So based on this information, it is very posible that He Kexin is alot younger then 16 and unfortunately we will never be able to confirm it.
First of all, no one in the world considers US gymnastics team as a serious threat. Who do americans talks up a good game prior to the competition, but once they loose, blame is placed on others? I have seen clips on nbc.com, and why is it that the american commentators constantly harping on the age issue? One of them (a male, but I don’t know which one) has gotten his digs in every day since day one. Whenever the Chinese shows up on an EF he has to make some comment about “does she look 16 to you?” This age controversy bullshit would never come up if the US had won the gold. The young
Send this by E-mail
Wow. People are really making this a big deal. Seriously, how can you fake it on your passport and birth certificate? Is it even possible? I just think that the U.S. are unable to accept their loss to the Chinese, and just because an American stated that she saw He Kexin has baby teeth, doesn’t mean that she’s below the minimum age requirements.
I don’t think it is the matter that the US can’t accept their loss to China, I feel it is more the “equality” factor. If she is not below the minimum age requirement then they should not have a problem at all producing the papers that prove she is of age and proving that in the national news light that they are being questioned in.
USA claims its a strong and confident country. Well it sounds USA thinks every one is out to cheat it with age limit, baby teeth, and what not. tsk tsk, US is NOT only a bad loser, but also a double head snake so excellent at creating lies.
That’s true. But I’m just mad because a lot of the press and other websites have stated that all the Chinese people are cheats, liars, and fakes while the truth behind this situation haven’t been figured out yet, and they still call us all a horrible country with horrible people.
I agree with you Tina, we should not be calling each other horrible people and cheats. As to respond to MuLan, the US was not the country that brought this whole situation to light…it was actaully newspapers in China that first began listing the gymnasts as being too young and that their birthdates were different a few years ago. I will say yes, I was disappointed that the US lost the team gold, but they lost it on their mistakes. The had the opportunities and could not capitalize, but what is boils down to is competition at this level needs to be fair. If they were not of legal age then they broke the rules. China is already VERY strong in the world of gymnastics and they do not need to lie about ages. So as I said before, if they are being honest, then all they need to do is provide the proof and this will all be over, but until then those gymnasts, and the country will have this dark cloud over what should be AND is a proud moment for their nation.
I was wondering when JK is going to pick this one up…
How about more fuel for the fire:
So far
Chinese gold medals: 26
Total medals for Canada: 0
@nic
If it is the equality factor, why didn’t Mr Hamm give up his Gold Medal for the all around 4 years ago? It seems the American press + public has forgotten all about that little episode.
your all idiots….the government for china could have produced these girls passports and making there birthdate whatever they feel like…just because there passports say they are old enough doesn’t mean a thing….when i got my passport in the U.S….who made it?? the US government…..same things with the chinese…the government made He Kexin’s and made her old enough to compete…the chinese are cheaters because they want the world to think they are so great…..tell me why this is the first year the chinese have actually been one of the top contenders and competeing with the U.S for medal count and gold medals? Scandilous other countries….thats why i never travel outside of the U.S because of all the scandals i have come across dealing with other countries government and policing…you all can stay mad that your country sucks and is poor….i’ll keep riding down the street in my pearl white escalade on 22’s doing whatever the **** i want
Hey Califigga, US isn’t perfect and maybe where you live, it’s great and seem like the finest place to live, but you are building a concrete wall amongst yourself. There are places in US that are poor and suckish. And besides, China was always one of the top countries with the most medals, the second most in 2004. US is always first because they have great athletes and China is now gaining up because they want to do their best on home soil.
I think you should stop calling other people idiots are start looking in the mirror and take a good look at yourself. You shouldn’t judge other people without evidence, He Kexin’s issue hasn’t been finished yet. Even if she is under 16, you can call the Chinese Gymnastics Team a cheat, I don’t care, but you should say bad things about the people just because other people do and the press reported it that way. These aren’t your opinions on China, because you don’t even know what China is. Which is a fact because probably the closest you’ve been to China was at Pick Up Sticks.
And you’re American right? If you are, you are not a good citizen. Haven’t you ever heard of innocent until proven guilty? You are rude, and you can start talking trash all you want, but if you can’t understand that simple little thing, I don’t think you even know your own country well enough.
If you hate China so much, then stop buying 90% of America’s merchandise, cuz guess what? Most of them are all made in China…Hmm…I wonder why?
Stop using one little incident that the gymnasts might have done to blame the whole country!
Wow Califigga…you seem so cultured.
Perhaps the reason so much of America’s merchandise is made in China is because the labor in Guangdong is mostly cheap underaged provincial girls who did not make the Olympic gymnastic squad. 东莞加油！
Actually, I love China very much and am extremely happy for the recent success of its female tennis players. Zheng Jie became the first Chinese tennis player to reach the Wimbledon singles semifinals and Li Na just beat Venus Williams in the 2008 Olympic competition.
中国加油！
I believe that He Kexin’s passport credentials are fake and that she should be disqualified from the Olympics immediately. Let’s not wait for He Kexin to appear on Chinese television several years later like Sydney bronze medalist Yang Yun and admit in an interview that she was only 14 in 2008. 国际奥委会加油！
I sincerely wish good luck to Liu Xiang, Li Na, Yao Ming, Wang Zhizhi and Guo Jingjing in their remaining Olympic events! 奥运加油！
An American dentist in Colorado would like to examine the young Chinese girl’s teeth. Opening ceremony singer Yang Peiyi, you might ask?
No, the teeth belonging to gold medal gymnast He Kexin!
http://www.krdo.com/Global/story.asp?S=8851045
whether He Kexin is 13 or 16 is the point. If she is 13 then the Chinese national team is manipulating a minor, someone who may or may not understand the punishment there body is under! She may or may not understand the consequences
Im sorry people but wake up. Rules are put in place for specific reasons. The discovery that a young teens body of 12-14 years is more nimble and flexible than a young adult isn’t news by any means. If everyone else is following the rules why doesn’t China have to? We have several gymnasts here in the U.S. that perform remarkably and would have contended that gold medal, but they were not present to do so because we follow rules and regulations set in place by the IOC. The fact that China produced false documents to slip these young girls into competition is disgraceful. You can make all the baby teeth arguments you want but when multiple sources from China have multiple articles about there [14] year old hero and are suddenly taken down by the Chinese government it becomes pretty blatantly obvious. My argument is not that it was unfair to the U.S. but rather that it was unfair to everyone. If all countries were allowed to use anyone they desired regardless of the age limit then we surely would have seen different results across the board in the gymnastics race. Would the U.S be on top? Would the gold have gone to Germany? Wether the age limit should be there or not is a moot point… Its the fact that if everyone has equal rules and regulations to follow isn’t it only fair that every one abides by them? Wether it should be in place or not, the point is that it is there and there for a reason. Nobody is exempt and if you don’t follow these specific rules, then you should either not be allowed to compete or be disqualified period.
To Califigga, I agree with Tina. Your most likely one of those hypenated-Americans. You’re either an American or not! It’s not He Kexin’s fault that the Chinese fixed her papers, if they did! Let the IOC handle it and it will get resolved.
It’s not even about the medals. I am an american and I am just very concerned for the girls’ if they are under 16. The legal age was raised to 16 for a very good reason. The torture they are putting the bodies through can be devastating if they are younger than 16. They’re at a very vulnerable stage in their development and too much stress could compromise their futures. Their government needs to think about these little girls and not their athletic reputation.
The fact that the IOC doesn’t want to investigate this means there are serious politics involved. By that I mean they don’t wnat to throw accusations agaisnt the host country of the Olympics. Perhaps they’re waiting for after the Olympics are over to launch an investigation. There’s a reason they set the age requirement at 16, because bones and muscles aren’t finshed developing at ages like 13 and 14 and can cause problems for these girls bodies later on in life. I wouldn’t be at all surprised if some of the Chinese gymnasts were underage seeing as this is a country that had no problem having children working in sweat shops. IF they do investiage and are found to have underage girls on their team, the team gold as well as all individual medals of the illegal participants should be stripped. It’s only fair and maybe sends a message to China for the next Olympics that cheating will not be tolerated. .
Its the integrity of the olympics at stake.
Too much has gone on already, such as the judges being bribed and what not.
Its going to get to a point where no one wants to watch anymore because it doesnt matter who wins.
Let’s see. How is it possible to fake a passport and birth certificate in a country where the government is Communist and controls the process and is using “Project 119″ to win more medals? Pretty easily seeing as how we can fake passports and birth certificates here in the US where the process is more closely monitored.
I think a lot of people are naive here int he US where Pro sports are more important than medals. China’s own Chengdu Sports Bureau has reported her birth date as January 1, 1994 as well as a report on Chinese television months before that she was only going to be 14 at the Olympics. NBC played the clip after one of the swimming finals the other night.
Re previous poster Wei’s comments. How about, Chinese population : Canadian population ? Mmm, according to that ratio, China should have hundreds of gold medals. And of course, why would anyone suspect China of doctoring any documents after their unblemished
record of honesty in recent years, such as a plethora of dubious ‘world records’ in the sporting world, not to mention their computer-generated firework display and the Incredible Miming Girl at the opening ceremony?
Some of the girls in the American look so young too. Shawn Johnson looks like she’s 15. What’s her real age?
;-)
I think this whole conversation is ridiculous. It seems as if some of these comments are not based on the situation. They are just a way to make hateful comments about other nations. I am a United States citizen and proud of it. However, I don’t think we live in a perfect place. That being said, who does? To characterize Americans as cheaters and liars is hypocritical because those are human traits, and that means there are liars and cheaters everywhere, even in China.
That being said, I wish the American government and media were more concerned with checking the validity of all documentation, including the illegal documentation used by undocumented workers, than whether a 14 year old go to go the the big girls competition. Priorities people?
Most people would agree that the right thing to do is remove or significantly lower the age limit, anyway. That means those gymnasts still would have kicked ass, only in a fair matter. Then again, what in this world is fair?!?
Additionally, to all of those who are commenting on the stress of those “poor young girls” who are competing at 14… each of the girls that you saw giving their all during competition have been training for years…. their body is under the same stress. They are competing in junior competitions with the same routines. The only difference is the platform.
Chinese girls tend to be very small, American girls don’t. I think a country with 1.2(?) billion people and a well-established gymnastics program has plenty of good gymnasts to fill their team without resorting to underage girls. The way I see it, if anyone has any solid evidence that any of the Chinese gymnists violated the rules, let them present it to the Olympic Committee. If not, stop whining about it. Behavior like that makes all Americans look bad.
The Chinese should be doing well enough without having to cheat, but that doesn’t appear to be the case. Considering that there are one billion more people in China than in the United States, surely they could have found at least 1 girl of age to challenge the best athletes in the world-Those from the U.S.
I don’t think that the Chinese press publishing a story about the age of one of their own athletes makes Americans look bad in any way. If America was so bad, then why are millions of people risking their lives every year trying to get in?
Just think of how dominant the U.S. would be with a billion more people to choose from.
I think the issue here is not one of whining on the part of the Americans, it is one of the Spirit of the Olympics. I am an American. Marion Jones was stripped of 5 medals and banned from Beijing. GOOD!!! How would you feel if you took second place and were stripped of the chance to stand on the podium as the winner because someone lied about using drugs or their age. Cheating is cheating no matter what country you live in.
And BTW for anyone not paying attention:
NBC, during the Olympics, aired a Chinese reporter doing a story on the ages of the Chinese gymnasts and showed pictures of the submissions to International competitions for the last four years. It is clear that about 2-3 years ago, the Chinese reported many of their ages differently. All of them were exactly 2 years older.
If Youtube had the story, I would post it.
i think the over under on her age is 7 im going with the under
There is something called rules that the Olympic Committee puts out. The reason for the age limit is that the younger are more flexible. If it didn’t make a difference why would the Chinese be working around the rules and regulations?
There are rules against drugs. Anybody caught using them, U.S. 2000 Mens relay team, have the medals taken away. I totally agree with that. It’s cheating. This is cheating as well. The rules should be enforced. Period. End of story.
From the NY Times
In Chinese newspaper profiles this year, He was listed as 14, too young for the Beijing Games.
The Times found two online records of official registration lists of Chinese gymnasts that list He’s birthday as Jan. 1, 1994, which would make her 14. A 2007 national registry of Chinese gymnasts — now blocked in China but viewable through Google cache — shows He’s age as “1994.1.1.”
Another registration list that is unblocked, dated Jan. 27, 2006, and regarding an “intercity” competition in Chengdu, China, also lists He’s birthday as Jan. 1, 1994. That date differs by two years from the birth date of Jan. 1, 1992, listed on He’s passport, which was issued Feb. 14, 2008.
Ok, check this out…
Look at some of these Chinese gymnasts. There’s NO WAY IN HELL that some of these girls are 16 (or 15), ESPECIALLY ESPECIALLY ESPECIALLY He Kexin!!!!!
Now, saying that He Kexin cheated (which I TRULY TRULY belive) does NOT mean that I believe all Chinese are cheaters! Nor does it mean that I think the Chinese government is corrupted (I’ve got NO problems with China, and I wouldn’t mind visiting there one day, either). I think that one or two people helped He Kexin produce false documents “verifying” her FALSE age of 16. I think they should take away HER medals, and HER medals only. Let the rest of the Chinese gymnasts who are OF AGE keep their medals, even though He Kexin cheated, helping them get their medals (team).
Also, this would allow Nastia Liukin to receive the gold medal that she EARNED from the uneven bars, because her routine truly was better (By the way, what the hell is up with the Austrailian judge?? And why do all the judges want to give the Chinese better scores when their routines weren’t better? Could it be because the Chinese girls are “cute” because they are so young? Hmmm… harder to give a lower score to a child than an adult…).
Not saying He Kexin’s routine was bad, I think she’s a phenomenal gymnast (as are all the Chinese gymnasts, although Nastia Liukin and Shawn Johnson are better), but… let’s be fair people, seriously.
If there are age rules, they need to be followed, and that’s all there is to it.
Of course everyone is going to think you are a bunch of liars, when during the opening games you have a “pretty” Asian girl sing infront of the crowd and have the “ugly” Asian girl with the voice behind a curtain just so your country looks good. You got more bad press from that than if you would have just allowed the “ugly” girl to sing face to face with the crowd. However, I do not believe it would be hard to fake any “offical” Chinese document considering that China will apprently do anything to make their country look good. There sure are a lot of Chinese athletes born on January 1, 1994.
I’m saddened yet frustrated to witness what China has stooped to, apparently. Why hasn’t this been investigated? How can cheating be tolerated and yet the child continues to compete? As a 45 yr old woman who did gymnastics many years ago, I agree that a 14 yr old girl can have an advantage over a 16+ yr.
My husband said that the uneven bar competition looked like a little girl [He Kexin] competing against a woman [Nastia]!
The real issue is the cheating that seems to go on and it’s tolerance. It simply is unacceptable to cheat. Now I realize that this little girl’s bones haven’t been tested to prove her age, but it doesn’t take a rocket scientist to figure out that her age is in question for a valid reason… She simply looks 12-13 yr old.
News clips proving her age? Make them available and pull her medals and kick her a– out of the competition. End of story.
The country of origin is irrelevant.
Cheaters are unacceptable, any time, any place. What kind of message do they think the world is receiving? A country based upon integrity? I certainly hope so, but it doesn’t appear to be the case.
This is bad for for China. How can their citizens take pride in anything? It is obvious that they worked very hard to show the world how hospitable they can be. Everything is beautiful. Yet, none of that will be remembered because it will be overshadowed due to a lack of integrity.
However, this situation is consistent with China. Think about the quality of China’s products [to quote a previous commentator, 90% of our products are from China because?] It looks like it could be nice and just as good as products made in the USA, you take a chance and buy it [because it's cheap], but end up throwing it out because it’s really just a front for junk.
How could anyone have expected anything more? Sad… truly sad. It was the one opportunity to change, and it’s blown.
Please let’s not insult each other. The American Team lost because they were not as good as the Chinese. I was born in a communist country where athletics are made not trained. I wouldn’t doubt that the government altered the papers to show she was older. But if it is true the Chinese newspaper first ran the story then I am not so sure. Remember, China may look and act in some areas as a free (capitalism) country but they are a communist country at the end. In communist countries nothing happens by chance everything is planned. Trust me I lived. Going back to the subject of the Chinese athletic being too young. I am not a doctor and I know they are not the tallest people in the world but just look at her face. It is like a baby’s face, very soft and without any signs of puberty. As a lot of you already know, when girls become women it is a hormone rush through the body. To me she looks 12. PLEASE do not insult each other; we all have our points of view. But remember anything is possible.
Why don’t we let them have fun in what they train for all their lives just about…. so what if she is 10 or what ever… if this is what she has train for so hard and she or any other person is ready then let them compete…. what is a 50yr wanted to compete are we going to stop him or her?
let people be china usa russia germany whoever… when it comes down to it we all bleed red. we can’t look at it from an american viewpoint all the time, this is an all country event.
have a good day and hug a chinese a russian a german a puerto rican hug any othere cause the next time your in need it may be just one of them that comes to your aid…. and never say never.
let’s close this topic it’s pointless unless you’re living in the stoneage
Peace
We need good planning(thinking)for successful life, establishing of Goals in our life and have funs…
MUST SEE website that has links to articles as well as screen shots of the articles explaining when & what they say of HE KEXIN …. very interesting stuff i must say!
http://cmp.hku.hk/2008/08/15/1177
The Chinese are definitely cheaters. I had Chinese neighbors, who enrolled their 2 kids in our school system as being about 2yrs younger than their actual ages. I know for a fact they are older because the daughter who is supposed the same age as my daughter was a toddler when my daughter was born…but now they are the same age—yeah right. This really sucks because it gives them an advantage mentally and also in sports. The son consistently does well in basketball…gee, wonder why when he’s 2yrs older than all of the rest of the kids???
There has been proof online of He’s age, but the Chinese govt. removed all of it…again, wonder why?? Age matters a LOT in gymnastics (and figure skating) because as bodies reach puberty, changes happen that make it more difficult to do some of the maneuvers. There have been lots of stories of gymnasts, dancers, skaters, etc. all of a sudden not being able to excel as they have in the past due to bodily changes through puberty. This is why age matters in gymnastics, and especially at a global even like the Olympics!
The Chinese govt. doesn’t care about people or about any of the spirit of the Olympics. What they care about is making China look good and making China, the country, exceed all other countries at any cost. They don’t care about He. She’s disposable as soon as her gymnastic days are up. That’s China.
1 shame on China IF the winner is under-aged.
2 shame on USA IF they are accusing underage if it was not true.
BUT MOST OF ALL why does it even matter what the age is? no one seems to mind other olympians being 15 or 14 in other sports. Isn’t this about being the best in the world? if so, then why should atheletes be excluded if they are the best of their country?
ADMITTEDLY i do believe 2 gold medals should be awarded if atheletes tie instead of creating some realllllllllllllllly dodgy system to break the tie using some random equation.
btw Dnn puberty lasts till 18 years of age for chicks but you don’t see the minimum age limit at 18 and yet by your standards girls minimum age should be 18 and guys at 21. oh and not all tall people are good at basketballs, some teams have a wide range of heights for their players. a tall person who can’t aim or shoot would do worse at basketball than a short person who can shoot.
Also asians enrol kids late into school because they believe their children will get picked on due to their size. so if you want to complain Dnn, you ought weed out bullying in school first.
To Tina and Mulan
I know of a Chinese person in Australia who uses 2 birthdates 2 yrs apart- she quotes one of them as her ‘official’ one and the other one she cannot explain
go figure….and she has passport/ other docs supporting her claims……….wonder how ??
Then again she is a tax cheat & immigration cheat ( visa overstayer ), so should be no surprise really
cheers, Jeff
ps she cites some ‘official blunder’ to explain how she has 2 completely different DOBs ( diff day, month and year….) big stuff up- i don’t think so !! cheater
Why is it that if anyone here, or any other web site can find proof of He Kexin’s age, the Olympics officials can’t?
Just put yourself in Nastia’s shoes! Simply not fair!
I’m Chinese, proud to be one, yet I can see this logically. He KeXin is born in 1994, according to several (not just one) older Chinese media sources starting from 2006 (Chengdu Sports Bureau website, China Daily Newspaper, Liu Peng - director of general administration of sport for China in Wuhan city). In a nutshell, these sources reported her actual age from 2006-2007 as she entered the gymnastic sport in China as a rising star.
And if she is really 14 as of 2008, then it’s not at all a case of sore loser syndrome for USA. It’s a matter of not playing by the rules. If the rules are legally changed and the minimum age is 14, then there’d be no controversy. No one would have any problems. All countries can openly use younger girls and everyone would be playing by the same rules.
Lots of other rules are broken all the time and athletes are disqualified, because those rules are normally investigated to the extent where you discover the truth. Doping is easily verified beyond a shadow of a doubt. However, as far as gymnastics, all they do is a simple passport check (almost like an honor system, or if you say you are this age, then you are), without any extensive verification or investigation as in the case of doping and other more easily verifiable offenses.
Also, no, obviously the Chinese people as a whole is not shady. It would be wrong to generalize any groups of people. But the government that has a lot of say in a lot of things (don’t even try to debate me that this is not true), is the shady entity. Don’t get me wrong. I’m proud to be Chinese and proud that the PRC is making steady improvements, but it will take a few more years to reach its potential and be respected in every way.
to me, what’s amazing is that it seems like most of the people that are commenting seem to be from China..esp the top three.i would assume ur writing for the Chinese gov to try to take the negativity of ur gov. pathetic!
A young girl:
“I have put in a lot of efforts and time in polishing my skills in gymnastic.”
“I hope to be a winner for what I have been trained hard for”.
“Now, my dream came true, I have won a Gold Medal, many said that I look like just (underage) too young.”
“I thought it is good to have a nice younger look.”
“My instructor did not train me to look older for the competitions.”
“I have proved to the World, even “young looking” can do better than “older looking”".
“Ultimately, I believe that it is my skill level that win the Gold Medal in the competitons.”
Interest info per Wikipedia, which is continuesly updated:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/He_Kexin
“There has been a controversy as to her actual age. Her 2008 passport and the Fédération Internationale de Gymnastique (FIG) list her date of birth as January 1, 1992,[3][4] which would make her 16 years & 220 days old during the 2008 Olympic opening ceremonies and therefore old enough to compete. However, her age as of 2008 was reported by the Chinese press as 14 in news articles[4][2][5] that were later taken off-line.[6][7] Her birthdate has also been given by the Chengdu Sports Bureau and other registration sources as January 1, 1994, which would make her 14 years, & 220 days old during the Opening ceremonies, and therefore too young to participate in the 2008 Summer Olympics.[4][2][6][7] In addition, in a November 2007 speech in Wuhan, Chinese sporting official Liu Peng introduced He as a 13-year-old.[2][7] On August 2, the International Olympic Committee stated that they would not investigate the discrepancy in He’s reported age, stating that the FIG’s own verification system would be acceptable proof of eligibility. The FIG, in responding to the situation, stated that they would not ask for additional proof of age beyond the passport already supplied by Chinese officials.[8][9] However, the matter continues to be a source of controversy among members of the gymnastics community and the media.[6]“
Andy, check state ALL the facts, not just some that you’d like to address.
You said that you are looking at this logically.
There are multiple places where He Kexin was reported as being born in 1992. Are you dismissing, denying that fact ??
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/He_Kexin
“There has been a controversy as to her actual age. Her 2008 passport and the Fédération Internationale de Gymnastique (FIG) list her date of birth as January 1, 1992,[3][4] which would make her 16 years, & 220 days old during the 2008 Olympic opening ceremonies and therefore old enough to compete. However, her age as of 2008 was reported by the Chinese press as 14 in news articles[4][2][5] that were later taken off-line.[6][7] Her birthdate has also been given by the Chengdu Sports Bureau and other registration sources as January 1, 1994, which would make her 14 years, & 220 days old during the Opening ceremonies, and therefore too young to participate in the 2008 Summer Olympics.[4][2][6][7] In addition, in a November 2007 speech in Wuhan, Chinese sporting official Liu Peng introduced He as a 13-year-old.[2][7] On August 2, the International Olympic Committee stated that they would not investigate the discrepancy in He’s reported age, stating that the FIG’s own verification system would be acceptable proof of eligibility. The FIG, in responding to the situation, stated that they would not ask for additional proof of age beyond the passport already supplied by Chinese officials.[8][9] However, the matter continues to be a source of controversy among members of the gymnastics community and the media.[6]“
Per Andy (comment#38)
“And if she is really 14 as of 2008, then it’s not at all a case of sore loser syndrome for USA. It’s a matter of not playing by the rules. If the rules are legally changed and the minimum age is 14, then there’d be no controversy. No one would have any problems. All countries can openly use younger girls and everyone would be playing by the same rules.”
You say… “if the rules are legally changed to age 14, then there’s no controversy.”
BUT, the current point is the current age IS 16. that’s the problem. nothing to do with sore loser or gold medals. nothing to do with one country vs. another country.
just the facts, ma’mam.
These 2 pretty much sums it up:
1) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/He_Kexin
2) http://gymnasticsnstuff.wordpress.com/2008/07/27/another-article-with-proof-he-kexin-is-underage/
In November 2007, Liu Peng introduced her as an “13-year-old uneven-bar gymnast.
ON May 23 2008 story in the China Daily newspaper, the official English-language paper of the Chinese government, had He’s age as 14.
On the Chengdu Sports Bureau website - Chengdu is the capital of Sichuan province in southwest China - a file dated January 2006 shows He Kexin as being born Jan. 1, 1994.
Somebody in Beijing with a registered journalist’s credentials needs to go to the next IOC press conference and ask about He Kexin’s identity card. The Chinese government probably found a way to alter that as well, but at least it’s another way to verify her age.
It’s time the international press exercise their promised press freedom and press the IOC into action with evidence presented on open laptops.
Here’s an article that discusses this issue and addresses why the IOC is stuybbornly resisting any investigation beyond examining He Kexin’s fake passport.
http://bleacherreport.com/articles/47945-government-conspiracy-invades-the-olympicsagain
Somebody in Beijing with a registered journalist’s credentials needs to go to the next IOC press conference and ask about He Kexin’s identity card. The Chinese government probably found a way to alter that as well, but at least it’s another way to verify her age.
It’s time the international press exercise their promised press freedom in Beijing and press the IOC into action with evidence presented on open laptops.
Here’s an article that discusses this issue and addresses why the IOC is stubbornly resisting any investigation beyond examining He Kexin’s fake passport.
http://bleacherreport.com/articles/47945-government-conspiracy-invades-the-olympicsagain
Andy, You are correct, no one should be including all Chinese people in their comments. If HeK is actually underage to compete I blame the powers that control this. This isn’t a choice made by her or the people of China. Just as the Iraqi war isn’t the choice of all Americans, but a government decision. Yet, it seems, the hatred by extremists include all Americans. All this is so unfair, but I suppose just human nature.
If HK is underage then she should not be allowed to keep the gold medal. Not because it would punish her but because it is the fair thing.
Meanwhile, I have to say that I believe the olympics have been wonderful, the opening ceremonies the best I have ever seen and the NBC coverage has been great.
Andy, You are correct, no one should be including all Chinese people in their comments. If HeK is actually underage to compete I blame the powers that control this. This isn’t a choice made by her or the people of China. Just as the Iraqi war isn’t the choice of all Americans, but a government decision. Yet, it seems, the hatred by extremists include all Americans. All this is so unfair, but I suppose just human nature.
If HK is underage then she should not be allowed to keep the gold medal. Not because it would punish her but because it is the fair thing.
Meanwhile, I have to say that I believe the olympics have been wonderful, the opening ceremonies the best I have ever seen and the NBC coverage has been great.
well… there is a lot of sources putting kexin at about 14 years old. not to mention china has had an athlete underage before and announced it on national tv after the olympics. look at yao ming- the chinese government has been monitoring yao since the day of his birth. he’s had foot problems and still they have him play tho apparently it’s extremely painful (and potentially career ending) if china makes him continue for now. so it’s not completely impossible. it just seems every time there’s some form of documentation showing he kexin’s actual age including old information in news papers and the internet- it all disappears. it is quite odd… and very questionable. i dont think it’s a matter of equality or being a sore loser or anything. it’s a matter of principal. if you’re under age- you’re under age. you do not belong in the olympics. however- if she is underage, it must be quite embarassing for those that lost to a 14 year old. that is impressive. but nonetheless.. the legal age to compete is 16- dont lie about it. very simple. there’s just too much pointing to the direction of “B.S.”- the chinese government puts a lot on perception. they wouldn’t even allow a little girl to be put on tv to sing their national anthem because she wasn’t “cute enough.” i’m not sure how you can say that about a 7 year old but… then again.. i live in the U.S. apparently things work just a little differently. it’s sort of sad really.
You’re all forgetting that China’s olympian’s don’t need to produce a passport to be in their own country. While I think it is a bit persnickety for US to bitch about He’s age, It is breaking the rules that she is under 16 and performing. She should be disqualified on that alone. Sorry people but I truly don’t believe she is 16. I’d feel this same way if it was any country and the loser was any country. Its just not fair game
It has already been confirmed that the Chinese gymnast, He, is only 14 years old. Her birthday is January 1, 1994. There are old articles in the Chinese newspaper, specifically one from last year where they even mentioned He as being 13. I have Chinese co-worker who actually has a printed Chinese article in which states she was 13 last year which makes her only 14 this year. There are also several old articles that were on the web that we have seen which have since been removed by the Chinese government. The Chinese government can easily change a passport. It just is not fair to break the rules and the fact that Nastia and He tied for uneven bars and then have the gold go to a gymnastic who technically doesn’t even qualify to be in the Olympics is just unfair — plain and simple !
well I guess people can’t let this go, but I guess they need to vent on something so trival.
Like i said before and somone here said it also these games are for the best of the world and if these people train so hard and are ready them let them compete what is wrong with that and what if a older person say 50 wanted to compete is there am issues there? If so then these games are just a bunch of crock cause of age limits there were no age limit in the orignal games why change now maybe they should look at these games and review it all.
Maybe they should have person only born the country compete even if they are a citizen of that country.
stop calling people cheaps and other names that are uncalled for when you do that you make yourself look ugly as a human. let this be and the powers that be will sort this out.
sorry for any typos hard to writing while the bus is moving
CC, bullying is nothing new in schools and certainly not an American specialty. Is it right? Of course not, but it’s something that will always happen to some extent everywhere, not just in US. Also, these Chinese kids are definitely not small. They have always been taller than average for their age (their TRUE age). I believe that they are lying about age because the kids didn’t know the language that well, so the mother wanted them to start “younger” so they’d have a chance to learn. That was her intention, but it’s unintentionally given them other advantages. The daughter messes up and says her true age sometimes, but then she quickly covers up. I think if you want to enroll your kids two years later, that’s not an issue—lying about it and making everyone think your kids are the same age as mine and everyone else’s is what I take issue with. At least be honest. I’m Asian and came to this country even older than her kids, yet we were put in the public school system (with me only knowing how to say ‘yes’ and ‘no’ in English), but all of my siblings and myself learned the language within 6 mos. It’s not hard for kids to pick up language, so it really wasn’t necessary for her to do that.
Also, I’m not talking about older kid sports, I’m talking about middle school & junior high as that’s their ages right now—and being bigger & older does give them an advantage. There’s a reason why our sports teams require proof of age when signing up, just like there’s a reason why there’s an age limit on gymnastics.
Oh, btw, Nastia was good enough for 2004, but she couldn’t go because she was only 14 (same age as He). Because she follows the rules, she missed out on an Olympics, plus who knows how well she would have done. Is that fair?
I’m also sick of the excuses being made for the Chinese govt. It’s clear, from the numerous previously published articles, that He is underage. What is galling is that the govt goes to these lengths to cover it up to further their ends. I know the Chinese govt is like that, so I’m not surprised, but I don’t have to like that this occurs. I think everybody needs to wake up and open their eyes to what their govt is doing…not just China. The USA govt is pretty awful in many different ways, but our people are just as blinded or indifferent.
Ok, this country is already behind them, so you know they faked her passport. they also deleted everything that has to do with her and gynastics. they wiped out every record except for a couple that clearly states her real birthdate. if they went back and deleted those records now, they they would have a higher chance of getting caught.But seriously she looks WAY to young. China shouldn’t get away with it! the olympics are in their country this year and they should at least set some standored of example to other countries…expecialy being a host this year! China should be kicked out for cheating if they caught them forigening the passports!
He Kexin is not 16 years old. China has broken the rules. End of story.
As other people have said, the sad part about this is that a Communist government has forced at least one (quite possibly more) little girl to lie to the world about her age, and she’ll have to deal with skepticism for the rest of her life if she doesn’t come clean.
It’s disgusting that some of you are defending the actions of an illegitimate country with no regard for human rights, a country so concerned with looking good that they take away the livelihood of their people, cheat in official competition, and pressure the Olympic authorities to look the other way.
LOL
So much sour grapes ;)
I enjoy reading these posts; esp when people think they have the right to change things…Just ask Paul Hamm why he still think he is the all around champ in 2004.
What goes around comes around.
In China, they have to have a birthing license. Now, with that being said, there is a record of He Kexin’s real birth. Since her age is such an issue, the government should produce this document and the ink needs to be verified to make sure that it wasn’t recently written (yes that can be done). If the government is not willing to relinquish this paper, then the IOC should launch a full investegation. If her age comes out that she is 16 or turning 16 this year then the athlete looks very young for her age (personally I am 29 and people think I’m 20). If her age comes out that she will not be 16 at all this year, then her medals need to be taken and given to the proper athletes.
It isn’t that the USA feels we should get all gold, but if every other country is following the new guidelines on age restrictions, then the host country should too.
I was NOT born in CHina, so I am not sure, to me my birthdate determines my age. I heard my parents mention in the old days, Chinese would count their age based on the year they were born in, NOT the actual birthdates. Is this still true today?
So if this system is still utilized, it makes a person at least one year older than their true birthdate. say I was born December 31, 1987, I would not have reached one year old until Dec 31, 1988 right? According to Chinese calendar or Chinese’s way of counting, I would have been two by Dec 31, 1988 Thus a new year is always an additional year/age for a person, not their birthdates.
Wei, do you think it’s funny when a country cheats, squashes freedom, persecutes people based on their religion, massacres Tibetans, tortures people based on political belief and restricts access to outside information?
Somehow I don’t think that deserves a “lol.” Grow up.
Califigga is perfectly right with the way the passports got printed. Just last year a chinese commentator introduced her as a 13 year old and there was no effort to fix what was said because it is true. Its not the US is whinning that they didnt win gold, but furious because countries, like China, cheat and get away with it.
Not only is China lying about the gymnasts age but the judging is ridiculous! In the womans vault finals, American gymnast, Alicia Sacramone, landed both her routines. Then Chinese gymnast, Fei Cheng, landed her fist routine and fell on her kness the second routine and beat Sacramone and took Bronze. Rip-off!!
17 Gymnastics Medals Won by the Chinese, 11 Gold, so far at the 2008 Olympics in Beijing.
Athens, four years earlier: 4 Gymnastics Medals, 1 Gold.
If she is 14 then China broke the rules, if she is 16 then good for her and team China. I think if this was a U.S. girl being questioned for being 14 there would already be an investigation going on by the IOC and people screaming for all of USA women’s gymnastics to be stripped of medals for these Olympics. But then again everyone loves to hate the U.S.
Well, I don’t think China cheats. It’s not even impossible. There are about 6 judges.none of the judges are Chinese or from China. It’s very clearly on the TV next to their score.They’re probably jealous. In school,the Chinese always got higher scores. The Chinese are good at everything and this year China has more gold medals.They just can’t accept China is on the lead.They have no proof China is cheating. No matter what you say or what you do. You can’t change the fact. Only losers does this.Some of the USA coaches are Chinese. They’re from China.For example Shawn Johnson’s head coach:Liang Chow. Liang Chow is a former gymnast and the coach of the volleyball team.
American Swimmer Katie Hoff won three gold medals at the world championships in 2007 and is preparing for her second trip to the Olympics in Beijing in 2008. Hoff competed in the 2004 Olympics at the age of 15, finishing fifth in her heat in the 400-meter individual medley and seventh in the 200-meter IM.
Why no age limit in Swimming ? No swimming for those under 16? I thought sport is good for all human beings?
Athletes are free go for any events if they can good at it ? Ultimately, The fact is they went there to show off their skills in the competitions.
Shawn Johnson is 16, but she looks too adorable to be 16. She looks more like 14 or 15ish, then again it’s just looks. It does not matter, besides rooting for the Chinese, I root for Shawn too. My family and friends agree that Shawn and Kexin look so adorable.
That sore losers Bela and Marta still annoy me. They are 70 years old, and they surely act like 15! [rolling eyes]
The so-called alledged babies really got them this time huh. ;-)
To chan:
Are you joking? There are no age limits for swimmers because their bodies aren’t being put at the same risk. Remember, the IOC (including China), voted on the current age limit for gymnastics. Any athlete who breaks the rules, no matter whether they agree with the rules or not, deserves to have their medals stripped for CHEATING!
I see a lot of America bashing on this post. The average American, i.e. ME, would rather see the most prepared person win regardless of which country they some from. Many times I have seem cocky, talented Americans/athletes lose because of their lazy training habits and I think that is awesome.
If you win and you deserve it, good for you. If you break the rules and get caught, “good riddance”.
However, I am all for lifting the age limit and allowing the best to compete. If we find out that a country is breaking any International laws when it comes to their health and well being, then we should step in. And in America’s case, if they have oil in their country we certainly will.
Hey MuLan:
Bela has stated many times that he is in complete disagreement with even having an age limit. He and his wife, both, would rather see gymnasts of any age compete if they are truly deserving. Bela has even stated that the Romanians faked passports before. He truly knows the ins and outs of gymnastics, the good and the bad.
You seem to be a people basher and should probably be kicked off the post. However, it seems like the moderators are much like the IOC and are going to let you and China get away with it.
Richard, it’s time to stop talking to these people. It’s obvious that they’ve been totally nationalized (read: brainwashed) by their govt. China is best, China never cheats, China govt is wonderful, etc. The swimming comment is a total strawman argument. You’re right in that swimming and gymnastics have no comparison in terms of what it does to the body. Also, there is the petite fact that the gymnastics governing body came up with the age limit. The swimming governing body did not for a reason. It’s not like we in the USA came up with the limit and all of a sudden decided to complain about it when He won. We’ve had gymnasts who missed out or were past their prime due to the age limit, but that’s the way it goes when you FOLLOW THE RULES.
While it’s true that China does remarkable things, it doesn’t totally offset the really bad things that they do. Humans are not humans in China. They are cogs—THINGS—for the Chinese govt. It’s too bad that so many of their citizens accept that and blindly trumpet the greatness of China. It’s clear to most of the world the truth regarding He. Only the Chinese don’t like to hear it, but then who likes to hear something bad being told about themselves?
America used to be a a lot freer, but in recent years, our govt has become more like China and thanks to the media our people are becoming more brainwashed unthinking cogs like in China. I think our govt has been taking cues from China’s iron-fisted management of their masses. Just today I read about two old women in their 70’s being threatened with one year of “forced labor” because they had the audacity to apply for a permit to protest in an area that the Chinese govt said was an official protest area. So far NOBODY has been allowed a permit to protest in these “official protest” areas, and in fact some who have applied for the permits have been taken away and not heard from again. That’s China for you. Be warned, with the kind of leaders we’ve been “electing”, we’re not very far from a Chinese way of life. Soon we won’t even be able to make these kinds of posts online or visit many websites online without running through proxies to get around govt web bans. But, remember, even when we go the way of China, we must always parrot about the greatness of our people and our nation, and if anybody says otherwise we’ll LOL and say sour grapes. We’ll turn a blind eye to the people who disappear because they don’t like the govt, or we’ll just have to suck it up when our children die in crumbling schools, or when babies and adults alike die from disease due to the polluted air, land, and streams. Think of how much we could produce when our kids get to work and all of us are paid a whole few dollars a day! Why, we could become a great nation just like China! And we’ll raze over inconvenient homes to build a giant Olympic center and force our people to learn to perform for the ceremonies—oh, only good looking people need apply we don’t want any uglies—we’ll do all of this to look good for other nations to hide the ugliness underneath the exterior that we don’t want people to see.
Plan:
61
Wei, do you think it’s funny when a country cheats, squashes freedom, persecutes people based on their religion, massacres Tibetans, tortures people based on political belief and restricts access to outside information?
Somehow I don’t think that deserves a “lol.” Grow up.
————-
Your canned answer makes me LOL a lot more; because you have no freaking idea of what you talking about.
TO RICHARD AND CHAN: the 15 year old swimmer was going to turn 16 in the year of the olympics, wich is the rule ! They must complete 16 in the year of the olympics, wich mean they can be 15 at their competition day…
He kexin was announced as a ‘13 year old gymnast’ last year, in a gymnastic event. I just wonder why no one bothered to correct them ! and no one bothered to correct the many websites that wrote things about her also annoucing her as 13 last year!
you know why? because He wasn’t in the chinese olympic team at the time ! in fact, she was only chosen to be a part of the official olympi team some weeks before the olympics!
If I were american, i would sure be pissed, because if it wasn’t for He, the american team would have had Nastia Liukin winnig the gold on the uneven bars, and the gold for the team ( i don’t know if that is the name, i’m from brasil) competition !
the chinese have LIED their asses off right from the start, about everything ! for god’s sake, they put a fake 9 year old girl to playback the original singer because they tohught she was too UGLY to sing in the opening ceremony! they also have FORBIDDEN chinese journalists to publish the death of the father of one american who was in beijing to compete in the olympics ! they announced the man as a ‘tourist’…
based on all the crap they have tried to hide, i have NO DOUBT this girl isn’t 16.
Richard and Dnn,
When USA reaches 1 billion population, it will be much worse condition than China now.
Trust me, you guys are so used to being spoiled, you will not be able to handle anything let alone natural disasters.
and yes, if the government is involved, OF COURSE she could have her ID faked !
and, by the way, china is and excellent competitor in the artistic gymnastic, but they had no one who was as good as Nastia Liukin in the uneven bars, except for He… and we all know that they were looking for winners in every single category! and i don’t think that that is a wrong thing - i think they are really good, fei cheng especially is terrific - i just think that there is no need to lie more and more as they have
To anyone listening:
The age rules differ from sport to sport. Figure Skating is 15, gymnastics is 16. For gymnastics the FIG raised the minimum age from 14 to 15 in 1981. In 1997, it went to 16.
So, Nadia won the event at 14, which was legal at the time. It is now illegal. BTW, there is a 12 year old swimmer in the Beijing Olympics from Cameroon, Antoinette Joyce Guedia Mouafo.
Also, it is not just He Kexin, it is all three of the following that have been proven underage by theie Chinese ID cards: He Kexin, Jiang Yuyuan and Jang Yilin.
MuLan - Thin of it more in terms of Population Density.
China’s - 138 people per square mile
US’s - 31 people per square mile
That puts China at 75th and the US at 180th in the World.
All those other countries (74 of them) have worse population densities than China and they are not all worse off.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_population_density
Natalia - There is a 12 year old swimmer in Beijing. The age limits differ from sport to sport. Men’s football used to be 23, figure skating is 15, gymnastics USED to be 14 and is now 16.
MuLan - Funny, I live in New Orleans where Katrina happened. Read up on what really happened instead of reading the tabloids. People who have no idea how democracy really works seem to think that everything should come free, even money!
True story: There are still people living in the government supplied (FEMA) trailers that have taken the money to rebuild their houses and bought plasma TVs instead and now refuse to leave the trailer because they don’t have enough money to fix their house.
@ natalia#74,
“the 15 year old swimmer was going to turn 16 in the year of the olympics, wich is the rule ! ”
She was born in June 1989, in 2004 she was 15. Going to turn 16 in the end of 2004? No, I think she was still 15 and half in the end of 2004 by western counting. In Chinese counting , she will be 16 and half by the end of 2004.
In regards to Passports, Every Government from the US,Japan, UK, and China, are responsible for all offical documents. So based on this information, it is very posible that He Kexin is alot younger then 16 and unfortunately we will never be able to confirm it.
First of all, no one in the world considers US gymnastics team as a serious threat. Who do americans talks up a good game prior to the competition, but once they loose, blame is placed on others? I have seen clips on nbc.com, and why is it that the american commentators constantly harping on the age issue? One of them (a male, but I don’t know which one) has gotten his digs in every day since day one. Whenever the Chinese shows up on an EF he has to make some comment about “does she look 16 to you?” This age controversy bullshit would never come up if the US had won the gold. The young