Shame on all people who think that they are SUPERIOR than others! We saw what other SUPERIOR people made with ‘less worth’ 6 million people during the II Word War.
What you SUPERIOR Greeks plan to do with less-worthy Macedonians? Or Slavs, as you say?
You say that all Slavs are not worthy just because they are Slavs (and not Greeks) or just Macedonians are less worthy? Same as Hitler said about Jews, Slavs, Roma, gay, writers,… BRAVO! And bravo for moderators!
I’m one of the worthless people (according to Greeks and Hitler too), so moderate me since by my genes I’m double-worthless.

I believe that the EU and NATO membership is highly overrated in both of our countries. Maybe that is because of our liberal “pro-western” governments. To me this seems out of place and time since the ‘west’ is failing quite badly on their policies – both on the economic and geostrategic fields.

If there’s someone we should try to cooperate with, this should be russia. I’m not suggesting being their pets but i believe it is on the rise and there’s money to be made.(hopefully our governments will distribute it fairly so that is actuly helps improve living conditions and services, but at least from the greek side i’m not counting on it).

Anyway, personaly i’m sorry about the nato thing, it must have been quite a dissapointment but i hope it’s all for the best.

it’s ok my friends, no matter what we do and no matter how much we try to prove to you that we should get along, you’ll never want a macedonian right by your (greek)side! but i will quote one thing:

“Dear Sir,

The hopelessness of the Turkish Government would make me witness with delight its being swept out the countries which it tortures: but without knowledge of resources available to support the revolt. I dare not take the responsibility of encouraging it in any fort or degree.

Next to the Ottoman Government nothing can be more deplorable and blameworthy than jealousies between Greek and Slav, and plans by the States already existing for appropriating other territory.

Why not Macedonia for Macedonians, as well as Bulgaria for Bulgarians and Servia for Servians? And if they are small and weak, let them bind themselves together for defense, so that they may not be devoured by others, either great or small, which would probably be the effect of their quarrelling among themselves.

Your very faithful

W. E. Gladstone”

this is the letter that Gladstone wrote to Hawarden Castle

so “And if they are small and weak, let them bind themselves together for defense, so that they may not be devoured by others” !!!
we are trying our best to be friends with the greeks – remember the 1995 change of the constitution and the change of our flag), we are trying – how about you???

They decided to buy 10 Bilion euros worth of weapons from France just to make a seal on French support. Don’t tell me Macedonian “sold it’s ass” to USA or stuff. We are not in a hurry to get in EU and NATO, we will wait for our time. Greece sold OTE and the Salonica harbor, they have nothing valuable left to sell.

Thank you for your time Hans, but you are just no for this kind of games.

The remaining historical issues, I have already said
what I understand. The only things one might add is that
Leonidas(of the 300) was also known as “Spartan”, not greek and that if anyone is famous or honored, this does not mean accepting what he says: He still must prove his position.

Same reason why you don’t like the name Greek-Macedonians.
-As addition it may be that Slavs have origin from the Balkan (migration South to North way before 6th cent) so you can’t call someone Slav – Macedonian when Macedonians are the Slavs. Not to forget violation of international and constitutional laws.

Exactly the opposite, Jews were not going to be considered to come from Egypt if there was no feed-back from the archeology (and there is). I will give you one more example… the Homer book about Troy was NOT considered a historical event UNTIL TROY WAS FOUND.

Curta on Macedonian would be translated into something like Dick (similar but not same). He is not Macedonian. USA does not give prize to things that are not acknowledged and verified. I also gave you an example of what Russians think about Slav origin. (so that makes 2 scientific circles already and there is more than a single evidence, I heard the Russian scientist took some 30 mins to gather all up including mentioning the Rosetta stone translation done in MK.)

http://www.runitsa.ru/ (it is on Russian)

Just as info (nothing to do with this post) there are elite scientific circles that are now rewriting the history of the Slav nation so that it matches the history criteria for authentic. Not like till today “You come from behind some mountains in India, how and when we don’t know”

- About Vergina – Kutlesh star. The flag was ALSO not yours, it has Phoenician origin and you may not believe it but there are Archeological evidence of that. I saw picture of a shield with the bud flower in the center and 8 personifications of the sun god in around the flower + 8 other gods around the sun circle just in between the pictures of the sun god. If you can count it is total of 16 figures 1 for each picture of a god found on that shield. That would wrap it up. Not to forget that even Greeks make the symbolic out using their gods.

About DNA, yes there are living ancient Macedonians. They are in mountains of Pakistan.

This will give you idea of the DNA and Mitochondria DNA composition.

http://www.pnas.org/cgi/content/full/98/18/10244?maxtoshow=&HITS=10&hits=10&RESULTFORMAT=&fulltext=macedonia&searchid=1&FIRSTINDEX=0&resourcetype=HWCIT

That flower shape picture will point to you how the nations are related (those taken into count).

PS. Yes I read the same books they did, doesn’t mean they won’t read the new ones as well.

‘Why not Slav – Macedonians and only Macedonians?

http://www.wmich.edu/history/news/spring04/curtareed.html

This is the place where a REALY respected historian gets his reward for his claim, NO MIGRATION OF SLAVS from 500-700 AD.’

You seem to have an obsession with the specific historian. I have read the link and the ones you sent previously about the work of this person. I aknowledge that he seems quite respectable from the links you’ve posted but I cannot seem to find any reviews of his work from third parties. Also I cannot find his country of origin anywhere and I suspect he’s skopjian (although that doesn’t necessarily mean he’s biased. Also some of his books seem to be released only for university libraries but not for bookshops.

Anyway, I will not jump into canclusions but please answer this for me if you have read his works. What evidence does he base his conclusions on?

I’ll give you an example to illustrate why i’m asking you this. Let’s say we’re looking for evidence that the jews moved out of egypt and we fail to find any. Does this mean they never moved out of egypt? Especialy when it is considered a known historical fact. Therefore, Mr Curta’s research could mean any of the following three things: A) He looked thuroughtly and there was no evidence of the migration so his theory is correct. B) He failed to find any evidence (that was there) therefore his research is incomplete and his conclussion is errorous. C) He only picked the evidence that suited his predetermined conclussion and dismissed evidence that dissproved it(propaganda). I’m not a historian or an archeologist so i’m not going to take a possition on his research. Instead I’ll try to find what the rest of the scientific community thinks of his work.

Finaly, any new theory needs time to be proved or disproved. It needs to be digested by the international scientific community first before it prevails as the official truth. It would be naive to jump into conclusions every time a new theory comes out. After all, a theory is a theoty, not neccessarily the truth.

PS There are hundreds of archeologists and historians who believe the opposite…

The arguement of ‘we are the true macedonians and you are not’ seems pointless from both sides since anyone who has even the slightest bit of macedonian DNA on him is legaly allowed to define himself as macedonian. Since even the ancient macedonians perceived themselves as greeks, if someone should use the name exclusively, it should be greece. But that is a bad idea since the slavomacedonians are legaly macedonian too. Fair enough up to this point I believe… But fyrom wants to be called ‘macedonia’. What would a greek macedonian consider himself as then? A citizen of a foreign country? And if the skopian side doesn’t give us the right of self-declaration why should greece give it to them for free? Especialy when we’ve got the upper hand. That would be madness. And even if the politians did it, there would be riots and revolution everywhere.

I understand the situation is similar in fyrom but in what way have they shown any kind of understanding for their neighbours?

http://www.wmich.edu/history/news/spring04/curtareed.html

This is the place where a REALY respected historian gets his reward for his claim, NO MIGRATION OF SLAVS from 500-700 AD.

So where do we come from now, Mars?
Still I think you should realize that Greece obligates us to change our name because we were a threat by its territory not because of history issues. That is why we should be named differently LOL.
I think now you realize that the simplest solution is for Greece to make this question unilateral and change whatever they desire in their own country to establish THEIR OWN desired distinction.
Whole world will be happy to hear this especially the Republic of Macedonia.

I am sorry, NOT HOSTILE? what about the beaten Macedonians in Greece in the last 2-3 months, smashed trucks, POLICE WAS THERE AND DID NOTHING.

I think it is time Greece solves its FRUSTRATIONS inside. If you think you made a big step, you will be surprised how many more you will make. BECAUSE you don’t have arguments. BTW VETOS, EMBARGOS, BEATING AND STONING people are not arguments of 21 century.

No the ball is on the right side. There is no frustration realy from the greek side. We’ve made the first step forward and now we’re waiting for you to do the same. We have even accepted that you use the term macedonia but you have to use a second term to disambiguate from the greek mace donia. That was a painfull but very large step from our side. What did fyrom do?
Secondly, greece is too small and insignificant to manipulate international organisations. Our government is too busy selling everything we own right now. I think the only two reasons we have the upper hand is because we are right and because you messed it up with suggesting there is a minority in greece and by trying to invent a ‘connection’ with the ancient greeks. Unfortunately for you, the world is better in greek history even than the greeks.
And one last thing I’d like to add is that I and most greeks don’t feel hostile towards the slavomacedonians. we are just very upset with the obvious provocations.

@ the other 2-3 GURUs You seek for thick wall, you do a check on Greek overall actions. I am sorry but that clouds my “thickness” and surpass it billion times. So don’t tell me who is thick, you want to gossip go in the local cafe’.

The ball is on the wrong side here. I think it is obvious Greece just wants to bully by using international organization to solve it’s own frustration. We don’t crack that easy, maybe in 100 years we will crack MAYBE.