Macedonia: Name Change to Enter NATO, EU?

Ever since Macedonia became independent from Yugoslavia in 1991, its name has been the subject of a bitter dispute with its southern neighbor, Greece. Greece claims that the use of “Republic of Macedonia”, as Macedonia calls itself in its constitution, not only violates Greece's historic cultural claim to the name, but also implies a territorial claim to the northern Greek province of Macedonia.

Instead, Greece, and the U.N. by default, have continued to call Macedonia by the name “Former Yugoslav Republic of Macedonia”. As former B92 blogger Lucy Moore points out, “It’s an awfully long name for a tiny country, but you can call it FYROM for short”. To which she adds: “With Greece still hung up on a name from the third century B.C., Serbia's 1389 claim to Kosovo suddenly seems more reasonable”.

Do Not Fyrom Me
Photo by Tigertweet, used with permission.

Now the dispute over the name of the former Yugoslav republic could jeopardize its bid to join the EU and NATO, both of which Greece is a member. An invitation to join NATO is expected at the summit of the organization to be held in Bucharest in April, and after Kosovo's declaration of independence last month, Macedonian officials say the country (which has a sizable Albanian minority) needs membership in the security organization, and later in the European Union, to maintain stability.

However, Greece has threatened to veto Macedonia's membership bid if it does not change its current name (Republic of Macedonia). In addition to NATO, Macedonia is hoping to start accession negotiations with the EU in the fall, based on an EU progress report released last week. The only problem could be, again, its name. In the words of the EU Enlargement Commissioner Olli Rehn, “If we can't settle this issue, I'm afraid it will have negative ramifications [for EU accession]”. Balkan Baby urges both sides to reach a compromise soon for maintaining stability in the region, with more flexibility on Greece's side:

Given the current instability which looms over the entire Balkan region, it seems highly irresponsible of the Greeks, as a relatively affluent country, to try and hinder the progress of Macedonia, a poor but democratically aspiring country which unlike Serbia wishes to bring itself closer to the West and encourages stability. Greek opposition is likely to infuriate Macedonian nationalists and this in turn could lead to a repeat of the bloody clashes that occurred in 2001 against the republic's Albanian minority. It seems that it is time for Greece to step down from its pedestal and start playing a more responsible and mature role in the region, something which for sometime it has tried to avoid as it promotes itself as a Mediterranean nation rather than being part of the Balkans. Out of defiance maybe Macedonia can ask for Greece to be forced to change its name to The Former Ottoman Hellenic Republic of Athens?

Dieneke's Anthropology Blog describes at great length the intricacies of the name issue, explaining why both sides have a right to the name:

The dispute centers around the issue of the use of the adjective “Macedonian”. This adjective has a geographical sense, describing someone who is from the geographical region of Macedonia. However, for the inhabitants of FYROM [Former Yugoslav Republic of Macedonia], it also has an ethnic sense, since many (or most) Slavic-speaking inhabitants of FYROM consider themselves to be Macedonian in an ethnic sense. […]
-The people of Greece are justified in wanting to deny exclusive rights to the Macedonian name to FYROM, because FYROM encompasses only part of Macedonia: geographically, the northern part; genetically, a subset of the Macedonian blood; linguistically, a Slavic dialect of the Macedonian region.
-The people of FYROM are justified in wanting to have some rights to the name Macedonian: they inhabit parts of Macedonia, they speak a Macedonian dialect of the Slavic group, and they have come to think of themselves as a separate nation from other Balkan Slavs.

Macedonia Greece
Demonstration in Thessaloniki for the name change of the Republic of Macedonia. Photo by Pappalicious, used under a Creative Commons license.

Both Macedonian and Greek bloggers feel very strongly about the name issue, which external observers like Greater Surbiton, find hard to understand:

…it may be difficult for a sane person to understand what is happening here: try to imagine the English fighting with the Welsh over whether Boadicea was ‘English’ or ‘Welsh’, or with the French over whether Richard the Lionheart was ‘English’ or ‘French’. Try to imagine the French fighting with the Germans over whether Charlemagne was ‘French’ or ‘German’. This is something that no mature, democratic nation would do. Yet in the twenty-first century, it is apparently possible for NATO expansion and Balkan stability to be jeopardized over something like this. In fact, the implications are even more dangerous: if Slavs are not allowed to share in the heritage of Alexander the Great, are British citizens of West Indian or Asian origin allowed to share in the heritage of Boadicea or Richard the Lionheart ? Are German Jews allowed to share in the heritage of Frederick Barbarossa, or Italian Jews in the heritage of Julius Caesar?

UN envoy Matthew Nimetz, who is tasked with helping Athens and Skopje find a solution to their 17-year-old dispute, has been busy since last month, negotiating the search for a name acceptable to both sides. He recently presented a set of 5 possible alternative names and has been meeting representatives of both countries. The proposed names were: Constitutional Republic of Macedonia, Democratic Republic of Macedonia, Independent Republic of Macedonia, New Republic of Macedonia and Republic of Upper Macedonia. The proposals were not very well received: a few Macedonian blogs circulated petitions against a name change, thousands of people protested in Macedonia, and there have been similar demonstrations in Thessaloniki, the capital of Macedonia in northern Greece.

The blog Say:Macedonia, whose author considers that “it is a basic human right to choose a name for yourself and to express your nationality,” comments on one of the most popular proposals amongst Greek media in an open letter to UN envoy Mathew Nimetz:

In relation to “Upper Macedonia”, while the Greek government has indicated its willingness to agree to this name (as the Greek media has reported in the last few days), it should be pointed out that this name is inconsistent with its official position. If an “Upper Macedonia” exists then logically there is also a “Lower Macedonia.” Therefore having this in mind, how can the Greek government argue, among other things, that the name “Republic of Macedonia” has irredentist claims on northern Greece, but the name “Upper Macedonia” would not?

Macedonia Ohrid
The Macedonian flag over the town of Ohrid
(Photo by rtw2007, used with permission
)

As NATO's summit in April is approaching, time is running out for a deal between Skopje and Athens to solve the 17-year-long dispute, so a few bloggers have made themselves useful by suggesting alternative solutions to the dispute. Here is Greek blogger's Eugenia Loli-Queru idea:

The solution is to make both countries, a single country. Call it “Macedonia and Greece”, or call it “Macedreece” or call it “Greedonia”, I don’t really care. The point is, these two cultures have MORE in common than they think they do. Ancient Macedonians were very similar in their culture and religion with the rest of Greece. It takes guts to merge two countries, but it has been done in the past, and it can be done again, peacefully. […]
My final argument is this: both cultures adore Great Alexander, and each one wants the hero to be their exclusive hero. And yet, all Great Alexander wanted for both, was a united Macedonia-Greece. By not having the wisdom to merge after 2,500 years, neither of you deserve him as its hero.

Other bloggers like Florian Bieber think that, following Macedonia's name proposals, generally republics should be required to add meaningful descriptive adjectives to their names:

“Smallish Republic of Montenegro” (SROCG)
“Kinda Democratic Republic of Serbia” (KDROS)
“Democratic Federal and Sometimes Confederal Republic of Three Equal Constituent People and Nobody Else of Bosnia and Herzegovina” (DFSCRTECPNEBH)

Now there's even a Facebook group where you can contribute to finding a solution for the dispute by suggesting a suitable adjective for Macedonia, which includes proposals like Post-Modern Republic of Macedonia (PoMoSoMa), The Not Even Remotely, Honestly not even a little bit, Hellenic Republic of Macedonia (NERHNELBHRM) or Ajvarska Republika Makedonija (ARM).

169 comments

  • bacmanov

    peter givens say all that all world must to understand … and the World already know that … 1913 is the key for everything … that agreement in Bucharest divide our country .. and the biggest part of Macedonia fell under Greece … there is historical maps from French scientist from England scientist which u can see it if u want .. Macedonia in 1913y is divided and we cant do nothing to change that … but that agreement from 1913 will pass 99 years and will be no valid in 2012 year.. England Usa and France are guilty for everything …

  • Andy Pozdivski

    How Simple.

    No other country is called Macedonia. No other country has ever decided or negotiated the name of another independant country. If Greece wanted to call itself “Macedonia”, it should have started 2300 years ago when King Philip of Macedon conquered the “Greek” city states. Oh, I forgot, the acnient Greeks considered the ancient Macedonans “Barbarians”.

    We are Macedonian not just because we live on the geographic territory of “Macedonia”, but because we are “ethnic” Macedonians. Ask the citizens of Greece if they are “ethnic” Macedonians- the only Greek citizens who will answer YES are the “ethnic” Macedonians who live in the north of Greece and are not recognized by Greece as a minority. I am one of those “non-existant” ethnic Macedonians born in northern Greece.

    Greece should bring itself up to the 18th century and recognize the Republic of Macedonia, acknoledge its ethnic Macedonian minority, and normalize relations with all of its neighbours- Albania, Bulgaria, Turkey and Macedonia.

  • Makedonia = Ellas

    To all those self proclaimed slavic Macedonians (soon they will deny they are Slavic, even though their offifial language is Bulgarian & Albanian – if Alexander the Great was alive now, he will be ashamed to call these people his own), i take the point that a country should be free to call themselves what they like, but i do recall that stealing or thieving is against the law, especially a culture and history that does not belong to you.

    Pop Quiz:
    *Macedonian is a Greek word, there is a meaning behind it, what does it mean in Slavic Bulgarian?
    *Ancient Macedonians worshiped the Greek Gods. If they were unique, why didn’t have their own Gods to worship? At least the Romans acknowledged they carbon-copied the Greek Gods, but just gave them a different name.
    *King Phillip participated in theh Ancient Olympic games, and ONLY GREEKS were allowed to participate in the Games. How was he allowed to conmpete if he was a barbarian (a term referenced to all foreigners who were NOT Greek)?
    There are many more questions but i think there is enough questions here for youo to fabricate an answer and propagate it as legitament.

    Why would Aristotle waste his time with a Barbarian prince??

  • Anita

    NATO and EU you should be honoured. I have never ever in my entire life been so hummiliated as I am now before entering NATO. You are all directlly causing racial disscrimination toward the Macedonian people world wide with this pressure for changing our name. I just want to remind you that the problems that Macedonia and Greece have now is due to European countries misstake way bac in 1919 when you partitioned my country. Thus, it is your job to correct your misstake now, otherwise pls do not interfere here. And one more thing MR Metew Niemetz should withraw himself from mediator in UN because he broke the law in UN for doing racial harrasment toward Macedonian people. Are you a democratic world as I though or you re some NAZI organizations? Shame on you. Not even for the price of collateral damage in my country, we won’t give up the name and nationality.

  • Macedonia=Hellas

    Methinks the brainwashing has become too firmly entrenched. How many times must you be reminded that Macedonia was Hellenic and the sum of all Hellenic provinces was called Hellas; there would no point calling the country Macedonia when it only constituted a portion of Hellas, thus this argument of “ethnic Macedonians” is redundant. There can be no such thing as “ethnic Macedonian” as these are Hellenic and “Macedonian” only refers to which strain of Hellenism they are descended from.

    As regards the “Fyromanian” minority, there is a microscopic one at that and that aside, many of these are in actual fact Hellenes who were expelled during the Civil War for being Communist and were barred from returning, moreover Florina is a region of Hellas not Lerin or any other idiotic name- this represents a further heinous attempt to usurp Hellenic territory as claiming that Thessaloniki is Slavic or the time where bank-notes were issued by FYROM depicting the White Tower in Thessaloniki which was a Hellenic garrison. Irredentist FYROM Slavs your arguments are ludicrous and the world laughs at you. We have history on our side- you have nothing more than lies and American Imperialist swine who care not for you but seek to infiltrate Europe through their puppets- you and Turkey.

    Thus far no one has had the guts or developed a brain-stem to answer my challenges; my dear Slavs stop the theft of history and do not bite the hand that feeds; for Hellas could very easily plunge FYROM into the stone-age on a whim were it not for the pressure of the Americans and the Turks stationed on the border of Bulgaria waiting for such a development- much like their so-called “liberation” of Cyprus in 1974 from the Hellenic Military Junta, which was nothing more than an unsanctioned and illegal invasion- an act of war had Enosis come to fruition.

    I urge you all to do some reading and enlighten yourselves- you have a history of using an identity created by a despot; while we Hellenes have a history spanning millenia enlightening the world- it is commendable you wish to identify with us but do not think you can steal our history- for too long we have endured the insults of “friends” who have sold us out time and again but that will change. And by the way, I grieve for my Serb brothers who lost Kosovo but the way things are transpiring it is a matter of time before the Ethnic Albanians in FYROM secede and join Kosovo which will in-turn join Albania creating a state of Greater Albania- which statistically means upwards of 25% of the FYROM population will be gone, then the growing political instability should prove rather amusing, for why would NATO and the EU even accept the ascension of a nation synonymous with sexual slavery, identity theft and drug-trafficking? I mean it is a no-brainer: you have on the one-hand the great philosopher and democratiser in Hellas and the rag-tag gypsy spawn of FYROM-Tartars, Avars and Bulgarians; I wonder which one is more desirable?

    In sum, cut the nonsense, get educated and accept that you are mere pretenders; Bulgarians who are obviously very, very confused- Delcev and Sandanski were Bulgarians! Actually no, technically Delcev is Greek because of his birth in Kilkis! Yet in a letter to Nikola Malashevski, Delcev states that he is Bulgarian.

    You bore me clowns, laugh it up now but rest assured the Hellenes will suffer no more insults at the hands of anybody and will no longer tolerate the defecation of its history and the theft of all that it holds sacred.

    I leave you with these:
    “There are Greek troops, to be sure, in Persian service — but how different is their cause from ours! They will be fighting for pay — and not much of at that; we, on the contrary, shall fight for Greece, and our hearts will be in it. ” Alexander the Great addressing his troops prior to the Battle of Issus, as quoted in Anabasis Alexandri by Arrian Book II, 7

    “Your ancestors came to Macedonia and the rest of Hellas and did us great harm, though we had done them no prior injury. I have been appointed leader of the Greeks, and wanting to punish the Persians I have come to Asia, which I took from you…”
    Alexander’s letter to Persian king Darius in response to a truce plea, as quoted in Anabasis Alexandri by Arrian; translated as Anabasis of Alexander by P. A. Brunt, for the “Loeb Edition” Book II 14, 4

    ΜΑΚΕΔΟΝΙΑ=ΕΛΛΑΣ ΓΙΑ ΠΑΝΤΑ. ΜΟΛΟΝ ΛΑΒΕ(Translate for the Slavs- it means Macedonia=Hellas forever; Come and get it.)

  • Macedonia=Hellas

    Okay my dear knuckle-dragging friends, for your reading pleasure- the word Macedonia means:

    According to ancient Greek mythology, Makednos was the name of the first phylarch (tribal chief) or progenitor of the tribe that initially settled western, southern and central Macedonia and founded the kingdom of Macedon.

    According to Herodotus, the Makednoí were a tribe akin to the Dorians, one of the principal ancient Greek tribes. The name probably derives from the adjective μακεδνός makednós, meaning “tall”, which Homer uses for a poplar tree, and which the grammarian Hesychius of Alexandria records as a Doric word meaning “large” or “heavenly”. It has been commonly suggested that both the Macedonians (Makedónes) and their Makednoí tribal ancestors were regarded as tall people.

    Highland and highlanders
    According to the World Book Encyclopedia, the names Macedonia and Macedonians derive from the Greek word Macednon which means high — a reference to the group’s mountainous homeland. The Online Etymology Dictionary summarizes these theories as:

    From Gk. Makedones, lit. “highlanders” or “the tall ones,” related to makednos “long, tall,” makros “long, large”.

    There would appear to be a synonymy among the names of different tribes living in the region: the most likely meanings of Dorians and Bryges also are “highlanders.” All the previous names are of Indo-European origin, the root of makednos being *māk-, “long, thin”, which becomes “long, large” in Greek. The syllables beyond *māk- are not a compound resulting from the process of production, but are an inherited extension of unknown prehistoric origin; in this case.

    Another hypothesis suggests that Makedónes may derive from an unattested ancient Macedonian bahuvrihi *μακι-κεδόνες *maki-kedónes meaning “of the high earth” or “highlanders”,which means the same thing but achieves the meaning with a compound rather than an extension.

    So my Slavic chums, you have been made monkeys of again.

    Enjoy. And a reminder: MAΚΕΔΟΝΙΑ ΕΙΝΑΙ ΕΛΛΑΣ ΓΙΑ ΠΑΝΤΑ. ΜΟΛΟΝ ΛΑΒΕ!

  • Lubi Uzunovski

    This issue isn’t about a name, it’s about minority persecution in Greece. It’s about the European Union giving Greece political cover and hiding gross human rights abuses.

    Please don’t be fooled, today’s Greeks are not related to Alexander the Great or anyone else from antiquity. Today’s Greeks represent new populations to the South Balkans, most are refugees and immigrants from Asia Minor and have only been in the area a few decades. The nonsensical historical claims being thrown about are merely cover for the Greek state to hide is rather insidious rights abuses.

    This issue cannot go away because large numbers of people are suffering. It will drag Europe down as details become more widely known. Greece expends a tremendous amount of energy and wealth covering up its abuses and we’re going to make it much more expensive for it to do so.

    It’s a disgrace that in the year 2008 Europeans are still covering up human rights abuses. Let me make it easy for you. People have a right to self-identify as they feel. They have a God-given right to identify as their parents and grandparents and ancestors did. No one, not even the European Union can take away a human beings right to freely express their ethnic heritage.

    Greeks are disgraceful human rights abusers. They’re lucky they live in Europe, you can still get away with cultural genocide and political terrorism in backward Europe.

    I’m a Macedonian from Greece. Does it look like I don’t exist? Let’s see you fake Hellenes talk your way out of this:

    http://hrw.org/doc/?t=europe_pub&c=greece
    http://cm.greekhelsinki.gr/index.php?sec=194&cid=508
    http://cm.greekhelsinki.gr/index.php?sec=194&cid=1239
    http://www.florina.org

  • FYROM-Greek

    I am from FYROM and I think the best is that we give up our slavic roots and join Greece, become Greeks and end this dispute the best way of all. FYROM brothers, I call upon your common sense and our best interests. It is better for us to become Greeks than to stay poor.

  • Ashly

    What a great story yall. Here is my 2 cents. Since i am from like New Mexico we are like Mexicans and share the same great history! Thats right, New Mexico = Mexico. I wanna know why every time i visit Mexico, they call me Gringo and not Mexican? Do they like not realize that i am from New Mexico, like ohh my goodness. Why the discrimination y’all, cant we all just like get a long and call each other Mexicans? Doesn’t South Mexicano know that we in New Mexico are like the descendants of the great Aztec civilization? Why do you think they call us New Mexico for y’all? I have like a great idea…here me out on this: New Mexico and Mexico should merge like because we are the same yall from Mexico! Wouldnt that be hot? Thats hot, like me ;-)~

    ohh, like what time is it? Is it time for MTV’s Road Rules. Ohh i just love watchin that show yall as a couple of seasons ago Road Rules were filming in my ancient ancestral home land in beautiful Puerto Vally stream, err no that wasnt it, Vallerrr, Vallarta! Thats it hehe.

    Ohh wait, where talkin about Macedonia and not Mexico. hey sorry for the mix up, they both start with “M” and i am a natural blond hehe.

    I think i can clear this Macedonia issue up real quickly yall. The official web site of the then president of FYROM, Mr. Kiro Gligorov, stated clearly that these people came to Macedonia at the end 10th century:
    “The beginnings of the statehood of the Macedonian Slaves go back to the end of the 10th century and beginning of the 11t, with the creation of Samoil’s state.”

    Also the first president of FYROM president Mr. Kiro Gligorov confirmed twice that they are not related to the ancient Macedonians:

    “We are Slavs who came to this area in the sixth century … we are not descendants of the ancient Macedonians.”
    (from the Foreign Information Service Daily Report, Eastern Europe, February 26, 1992, p. 35. )

    “We are Macedonians but we are Slav Macedonians. That’s who we are! We have no connection to Alexander the Greek and his Macedonia. The ancient Macedonians no longer exist, they had disappeared from history long time ago. Our ancestors came here in the 5th and 6th century (A.D).”
    (from the Toronto Star newspaper, March 15, 1992)

    Wow, i like had a flash back yall. I hope i cleared this up for yall

    Aztec yall, thats what its all bout–stop hatin south mexico!
    One love
    Ashly
    Mexicana4life yall

  • Voice of Reason

    “What is in a name” Well the argument goes both ways doesn’t it?

    How would you feel if you had finished your studies, opened a doctor’s office and then… another person who claims to have the same name/birth date as you shows up, opens another doctor’s office across yours, writes checks on your name, makes purchases etc? And don’t tell me that it is identity theft, because “what is in a name” right? And of course the right to “self-determination”.

    By the way you don’t even know your own name or birthday “for fact”; others told you those (your parents, birth certificate)..

    Yet I think you would be somewhat annoyed if someone attempted some identity theft using your name, wouldn’t you? Now how do you apply “identity theft” in interntional law?

    Personally I appreciate that the Macedonians Slavs have decided to distance themselves from the Bulgarians and have pursued the cultural riches of Macedonia to reinforce their identity. I don’t think anyone in the Balkans has suffered more for what they are than them which explains their “stubbornness”.

    What they have to understand though is that they don’t exist alone in Macedonia and their “exclusivity” claims put forth by the “Republic of Macedonia” name create an imbalance no least among the 2.2 million Greek Macedonians. Also they imply that they govern Macedonia region in Greece and they have followed a really short sighted policy of provocations (Vergina star only discovered in 1977 became a national symbol, or naming airports etc after people they have no relation with).

    In fact only a small part of FYROM belongs to the historical geographical Macedonia region so the inferences to irredentist claims by claiming the name “exclusivity” are so eye striking!
    (what is Macedonian in (Tito) Veles, ancient Vylazora, capital of Macedonians’ arch-enemies Paeonians and Skopjie, ancient Skoupoi, capital of Macedonians’ arch-enemies Dardanians?) But then what is history and geography.. what is a birth certificate, social security number and how do you know who your parents are for fact, right?

    Also note that the Macedonan Slav language does not have the “ks” and “th” sounds that are needed to pronounce “Alexandros” and “Thessaloniki”. Also one wonders when did the Macedonians become Christians.. in Apostle Paul’s times (Epistles to Philippeans/Thessaloniceans) or under the Apostles of SLAVS 8 centuries later? Distinct people have distinct historical events/liguistic characteristics and it’s obvious that the Macedonian Slavs have no relation to the historical Macedonians.

    Anyway you can see these types of things around the world (Mexico, New Mexico, North Korea and South Korea, Guinea-Bissau and Equatorial Guinea in Africa… Even Guinea in SE Asia is called Papua New-Guinea).

    The irony is that at the same time Greece is the #1 investor and Greek private sector companies #1 employer. Greece also offers the Thessaloniki port (connected with Egoumenitsa port and Western Europe via Egnatia
    Highway) for FYROM’s imports/exports etc.

    A composite name for every use, scrapping their lunatic claims etc will ensure a brighter future for all.
    And in fact Greece is the ONLY neighbor with no claims on FYROM (Serbians call them Old Serbia, Bulgarians consider them Bulgarians and as for Albanians no comment).

    Finally the Interim Agreement describes what people have dais BUT FYROM also agreed to reach a mutually accepted name. Instead FYROM has pursued its recognition as “Republic of Macedonia” which of course is an eye-striking violation of the Interim Agreement.

    Be well and sorry for the long message!

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